Intro: [upbeat music] Welcome to the Spoken Gospel podcast. Spoken Gospel is a nonprofit dedicated to the idea that every part of the Bible, Old Testament and New, is about Jesus, and this podcast is our experiment to publicly test that belief. Every episode, hosts David Bowden and Seth Stewart work through a biblical text to see how it helps us see and savor Jesus. Let's jump in. [upbeat music]
David: Well, welcome everyone to the Spoken Gospel podcast. We're so thankful that you're joining us. Seth, how are you feeling today as we approach the book of Kings?
Seth: Man, Kings is a, a beast.
David: It's a beast.
Seth: It's a beast. I don't know if... I mean, 480 years of Israel's history have already passed-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... up until this point, and I'm pretty sure they kinda like mark it as another 480 years.
David: Mm.
Seth: Like, that's like chronologically they kinda put it in there so you have like a multiple of 12. Anyway, it's like-
David: Oh
Seth: ... it's like a whole thing.
David: Okay.
Seth: It's a whole numbers thing, you know-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... the Bible.
David: They like... uh, the Bible likes numbers.
Seth: So, but anyway, trying to fit 480 years of history into, like, one book-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... just felt really overwhelming.
David: Yeah.
Seth: But I'm also really excited because it's like, I feel like this is one of the f- it's, it's not the only book that I've felt like at my end of understanding.
David: Mm. Mm-hmm.
Seth: Like I felt like Ecclesiastes was that way.
David: Yep.
Seth: But this one, if we're... Like, Ecclesiastes felt deep.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: This one just feels, like, massive.
David: Unexhaustible.
Seth: Yeah, it's just like this-
David: Inexhaustible
Seth: ... giant history of a nation from its founding to its exile-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... and how the Lord, like, did stuff, how He spoke to-
David: Right
Seth: ... prophets, how He ruled through kings-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... how bad people were, how He pr- like, there's a lot. Like, how wisdom works, how-
David: Yeah, 'cause the, it, the issue is, and we should just talk about this, that 1 and 2 Kings-
Seth: Mm
David: ... that we're just gonna call Kings 'cause it's one book.
Seth: One book.
David: Um-
Seth: It was two scrolls
David: ... it was two scrolls.
Seth: Yeah, that's it.
David: Yeah, but it's one book, uh-
Seth: It's one book
David: ... is not a history book, even though it's about history. It's not a political book, even though it is about politics, right?
Seth: Yeah.
David: It is a theology book rooted in history and politics. And so, like, what I feel overwhelmed by is, is-
Seth: It has an agenda.
David: Right.
Seth: Yeah.
David: What I, I don't feel overwhelmed by, okay, let's trace the kings and who ruled when and what happened and why and da, da, da, da, da.
Seth: Mm.
David: That's not overwhelming. That just takes time to-
Seth: Memorization
David: ... and memorization, like, uh, which I kinda remember, like, that is what my classes were in, like, seminary, were just like-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... list the kings in order, uh, of Israel, and then list them in order in Judah. And it was like-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... boring-
Seth: It, yeah
David: ... and, like, kind of pointless. So, like-
Seth: Yeah. It's helpful to w- to, like, to understand the flow of the book.
David: Yeah.
Seth: But even then, it's like th- that's the, the, the historical setting-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... is just that.
David: It's a backgr-
Seth: It's the-
David: ... it's a backdrop
Seth: ... it's the setting for God's work and God's wisdom-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... and God's message and God's words. Like, I mean, that's probably a pretty good, like, thesis for our lives in general.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Like, the most important thing is not our lives.
David: Mm.
Seth: Like, the s- like, our lives as we live them and have children and-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... like get a job.
David: What job you had, when you got your promotion, where you lived.
Seth: All that is historical background-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... to the drama of what God is doing in us and through us and is communicating to His people.
David: Yep, about Himself.
Seth: About Himself.
David: Yeah. Yeah, totally. And so anyway, that was a very meta way to start the podcast. [laughs]
Seth: It is such a meta way, but it's like, I don't, like, I don't know how-
David: Welcome to waxing eloquently with Spoken Gospel. [laughs]
Seth: Or just waxing. Eloquently is, like, up for debate, but we have waxed on Spoken Gospel, and now we will wax off.
David: Okay. [laughs]
Seth: Goodbye, and we will see you next week. [laughs]
David: No.
Seth: No?
David: Do not, do not change that channel.
Seth: Not enough? Okay.
David: Okay. Um, so, uh, where are we in Israel's history when we've come to the book of Kings?
Seth: Yeah.
David: Right? So, like-
Seth: I mean, if you've been following us from the very beginning, you'll know that God has chosen a people-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... the people of Abraham, and God promised Abraham that He would give him, uh, children that would outnumber the sand on the s- sea.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And that, w- for the first time, will actually get repeated in the book of Kings, not as a promise, but as a fulfillment.
David: Mm.
Seth: So we actually get the fulfillment of the promise that God made to Abraham 480 years ago. It's a b- or no, at this point, it's even longer.
David: It's way longer.
Seth: It's way longer.
David: Yeah.
Seth: Long time ago. It actually happens.
David: Mm.
Seth: So that's the story we're tracing, the story of the family of Abraham becoming a, m- a, a, a-
David: A nation
Seth: ... a nation-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... that is innumerable-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... and going from a tribe, and fr- from a clan to a tribe to a kingdom.
David: Yeah.
Seth: Um, and now we are on the very beginning of, um, Israel as a kingdom-
David: Right
Seth: ... like, with an actual king.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: So you had this period of time in the book of Judges-
David: Right
Seth: ... bleeding over to the books of 1 and 2 Samuel, where they were ruled by tribal chieftains-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... tribal leaders, uh, these people like Deborah, these are people like Samuel.
David: Yep, that God would raise up.
Seth: He would raise up to accomplish His purposes, um, and-
David: Fight against the enemies
Seth: ... fight against the enemies, but also judge Israel to a certain extent.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Now, as we transition into Kings, we get the transition from tribal forms of government-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... which would basically be decentralized. Now you have a central government ruling all the tribes.
David: Right, which started with Saul, who failed-
Seth: Mm
David: ... and then ultimately King David, who succeeded, which we read about in 1 and 2 Samuel, and now S- uh, Kings opens with David's death.
Seth: Yes.
David: Yeah.
Seth: So at the very end of 2 Samuel, you're getting, like, David's rise and fall, David's rise to power and his descent and fall-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... from grace after Bathsheba and w- everything else that goes on in his life, and really, the fulfillment of God's promises in 2 Samuel 7. God promised Samuel that his son would reign on a throne forever.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: So when we open up 1 Kings, we have David dying and his son, Solomon, taking the throne.
David: Yeah, or better-There's two sons.
Seth: Two sons, yes.
David: Yeah, and who's going to, who's going to be the promised son is the question.
Seth: Yes.
David: Is it, is it Adonijah? Is it-
Seth: It's Adonijah-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... and Solomon, and there's ac- it's, like, a lot of fun tension. It's like-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... who's gonna rule?
David: And Adonijah's older.
Seth: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
David: But, uh, and Solomon is younger, and also the son of his weird marriage with Bathsheba, so it's like, I don't know, I'd probably choose Adonijah if I was just picking blind here, you know, [laughs] without any knowledge. Anyway, so it is interesting.
Seth: Yes, so-
David: That's just all the historical things that are happening, you know-
Seth: Yes
David: ... to lead us to this point.
Seth: So, yeah, and you're absolutely right. So when we open up I and II Kings, what we get, we're introduced into a battle for kingship.
David: That's right.
Seth: Who is the promised son?
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Adonijah or Solomon?
David: Right.
Seth: And that's how the Book of Kings starts.
David: Yes, and that's really the question that should be ringing in our ear throughout the entire book, is who is the promised son who will sit on the throne forever? Because-
Seth: 44 chapters should tell you-
David: Yeah. [laughs]
Seth: ... that it's not Solomon. [laughs]
David: It's not Solomon. And so, like, really at the end of the book, there's still this question of, like, is there a promised king? Who is the promised king? And so the, the, so-
Seth: So y-
David: ... the conflict at the beginning really carries throughout the entire book.
Seth: Yeah, and it's even, like, and that who is the king that will sit forever is really important-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... because the very last story we're told is a really strange one-
David: It is
Seth: ... in the Book of Kings.
David: Yeah.
Seth: So essentially, spoiler, Israel goes into exile. [laughs]
David: [laughs]
Seth: They go to Babylon. The kingship is diminished. Everyone's destroyed or sent off to some random place to be controlled by Babylon. Except for one heir of David's throne, who is allowed permission to sit at the King of Babylon's table.
David: Even though he was evil.
Seth: Even though he was evil.
David: Yeah.
Seth: "And in the 37th year of the exile of Jehoiachin king of Judah, in the 12th month, on the 27th day of the month, Evil Merodach, king of Babylon, in the year that he began to reign, graciously freed Jehoiachin," or Jehoiachin. Jehoiachin?
David: Jehoiachin?
Seth: Jehoiachin.
David: Eh, you know, it's a transliteration.
Seth: It's whatever it is, his name, king of Judah, from prison. The king of Babylon-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... frees the king of Judah from prison, speaks kindly to him, and gives him a seat above the seats of the king, where with him in Babylon. So you still have a king.
David: Yep, there's still a king.
Seth: All-
David: He's in exile
Seth: ... in exile, but he's privileged and next to power.
David: Right.
Seth: But that's how the book ends.
David: Yep.
Seth: So is he the son that will stay forever? Well, he's not on God's throne. He's not on-
David: Right
Seth: ... Israel's throne. God s- doesn't seem to have abandoned his promises, but the question that we ha- we're starting the book with remains.
David: That's right.
Seth: Who-
David: Who's the king that will last forever?
Seth: Who's the king that will [laughs] last forever?
David: That's right. Yeah, and so that, that's really a central question that the book is answering. And obviously, this is the force, um, uh, uh, of the argument of the entire Old Testament that leads us to Jesus, uh, that people have been waiting for a king. And so when Jesus comes to earth and people call him king, and, you know, Pilate asks him, "Are you king of the Jews?" You know, he's asking the same question. Are you this king they've been waiting for, that they're claiming that they, they need and have, and is it you? Like, that's, that's-
Seth: You have said so.
David: You have said so. [laughs]
Seth: [laughs]
David: Is what Jesus says to Pilate. And so, um, that, when Jesus comes and claims that he is the king, the son of David, he is fulfilling the Book of Kings.
Seth: That's exactly right.
David: This, this promise.
Seth: And it also-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... proves to you, like, what you said at the beginning, is that this, the, the historical backdrop is proving a theological point.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And in some ways, they're inseparable from one another.
David: Right.
Seth: You cannot separate the political drama of a king-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... from God as king-
David: Right
Seth: ... within a political sphere where Pilate, a Roman governor, murders him.
David: Right. Any more than you could separate the atonement of our sins from the crucifixion of Jesus on a Roman cross historically.
Seth: You need the, both the history and the theology to come together.
David: That's right.
Seth: And the Book of Kings is always doing that.
David: Yeah.
Seth: So, like, yes, anyway, so that's the question, who is this king?
David: Yep.
Seth: But what's fascinating-
David: Mm
Seth: ... that I thought as we were studying this whole book was that the kings of Israel, again, feel like more like secondary actors-
David: Yes
Seth: ... to the prophets within Israel.
David: Right.
Seth: Now, we picked up on this in Samuel as well-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... how the king, the prophets seem to take more of a central role than the kings did. And the kings, whether or not they listened to the prophets, was what caused both Saul's and David's downfall.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And we kinda have a similar thing happening in the book of I and II Kings.
David: That's right.
Seth: And here's just a really cool meta point to make the point that the kings are the historical background to the actions of the prophets themselves.
David: Mm.
Seth: So think about this.
David: Yep.
Seth: So the world was created in 10 words.
David: Oh, boy.
Seth: So the world, so when God spoke in-
David: Okay
Seth: ... in Genesis 1-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... God speaks 10 times, and he said, "Let there be light," and he said, "Let-"
David: Oh, okay
Seth: ... "water, like, be there," and-
David: There's-
Seth: ... blah, blah, blah.
David: There's 10 and he saids?
Seth: There's 10 and he saids.
David: Okay, okay.
Seth: 10 and he saids. When-
David: Is that, like, common Christian knowledge?
Seth: I don't think it is.
David: Okay, I was like, I didn't know that. [laughs]
Seth: There's 10 and he saids.
David: Okay. [laughs]
Seth: And then on Mount Sinai, God has 10-
David: 10 Commandments, I know that one
Seth: ... yeah. [laughs]
David: Did I get that one right? [laughs]
Seth: You got that one right. He says 10 things, and they're even called 10 words.
David: Words.
Seth: Right?
David: They're called the 10 words.
Seth: And now here in the Book of Kings, which outlines the entire history of Israel's kings-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... and is summed up as 480 years, which is a multiple of numbers.
David: Yeah. [laughs]
Seth: And I, I for- I forget, what is 480 divided by 12? Anyway, it's like a-
David: Do not ask me those questions.
Seth: Don't. Anyway, uh, there are 10 prophets-
David: Uh-huh
Seth: ... over the whole span of Israel's kingdom.
David: Mm. Or at least 10 that are highlighted in the book.
Seth: Ten li- yeah
David: Yeah
Seth: . Ten that are, like, it's a selective history of these 10 prophets-
David: That's right
Seth: ... throughout this book, and there are 10 of them.
David: Okay.
Seth: So I think what you're supposed to be reading here is, like, God is speaking again into this new Eden project-
David: Uh-huh
Seth: ... this new world project. Like, we keep reframing each, like, section of history as a r- attempt to bring about Eden.
David: Absolutely.
Seth: Joshua was attempt about bringing about Eden. Moses was a attempt to bring about Eden. Um, Samuel and David were attempts to bring about Eden.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And Solomon, we'll get to that in a moment-
David: Yep
Seth: ... I'm sure, is another attempt to bring about the new Eden.
David: Right.
Seth: And then when you look at Israel's whole history from the establishment of its throne in s- in David and S- Solomon to the end of its exile, there are 10 words-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... from God into that world.
David: Right. God is try- God is bringing about- God is seeking to bring about new creation-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... like he did in the beginning when He spoke. He's now speaking words through his prophets to bring about new creation in-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... you know, sinful Israel.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: Uh, and he's doing it through words, like through commands-
Seth: Yep
David: ... telling them to repent, to-
Seth: Yes
David: ... not worship false gods. He's, even some of the things are getting, that were in the Ten Commandments, are getting repeated on the lips of the prophets.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Yeah.
Seth: More important than the historical succession of kings is the words God is speaking to His people.
David: Yep.
Seth: And this point is made even, like, by just, uh, like, looking at the book.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: So you have 11 chapters devoted to setting up King Solomon.
David: Right.
Seth: And then you have over 400 years of history that go by in moments.
David: Right.
Seth: You have half a chapter dedicated to 30 years, another half chapter dedicated to 60 years.
David: Right.
Seth: Several verses for another decade. The idea is the historical backdrop of the kings is not center stage.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: The words the prophets are.
David: Right.
Seth: But what God is speaking through these 10 people is more-
David: Right, because the, the middle of the book is all about the ministries of Elijah-
Seth: Yep
David: ... and Elisha, and they take up this huge amount of space. Um, and it's all about the prophetic ministry of these guys. They're performing miracles.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: They're speaking the word of the Lord. They're rebuking kings, both-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... domestic and foreign. [laughs]
Seth: Yes.
David: You know? And so it's like the central work. And, I mean, this has always been the way that, um, the, the Jewish people have treated this book. It is not classified as history in their canon, their collection of scriptures.
Seth: Right.
David: It is classified as part of their-
Seth: Yes
David: ... prophets.
Seth: Right. We, we put this in, like, our historical books.
David: Right.
Seth: But if you go and get a Tanakh-
David: Yep
Seth: ... a Jewish Old Testament, it's not even considered history. It's considered prophetic literature.
David: Right. [laughs]
Seth: There's, like, a history of understanding-
David: Yes
Seth: ... Kings not as a succession of kings leading up to the exile.
David: That's right.
Seth: It's a prophetic literature-
David: It's a prophetic work
Seth: ... teaching us something about God.
David: Yeah. A- another point I wanna make about that that's just, like, if y- if you aren't convinced yet, here, here's the thing that broke it for me, that I was like, "Okay, I'm all in on this-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... prophetic thing," uh, is there's this constant kinda confusing, uh, statement that's made usually at the end of every king's life.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: And it's, "And the rest of the acts of King Solomon, are they not recorded in," and then it cites a source. It could be the Acts of Solomon or the, uh, the Chronicles-
Seth: Book of Chronicles
David: ... of the Kings of Israel, the Chronicles of the Kings of Judah, these books that we don't have anymore.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Uh-
Seth: It's not the Book of Chronicles?
David: No. Huh, it's different.
Seth: Oh, okay.
David: Yeah. And so, um, y-
Seth: If you're, if you're confused, at the end of every king-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... basically it says, "Are not these acts recorded in..."
David: Yep.
Seth: And they list a book-
David: Right
Seth: ... where you can read about that king somewhere else.
David: And it's like, and it, it says, "Are not the rest of the acts of this king..." So it's like, and, and sometimes we get hints of what he, what he talks about. Some, some kings, it's his building projects or his wars or his policies, and it's like if this was a political book, wouldn't those be the things that we focused on? What did this king do? Like, we'll be told that there's a good king even who reigned for, like, over 40 years, had a really long rule, and he has no mention of what he d- what he's done. We're just told that he lived, was good, died, and that his details are somewhere else.
Seth: [laughs] Yeah.
David: And, like, that's just proving that this is not a history book. It's not concerned with history. It's concerned with prophetically highlighting what is going on in Israel as it pertains to-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... Israel's kings obeying the word of the Lord.
Seth: Yes.
David: Will they obey? Let's find out. [laughs]
Seth: Yep.
David: Like-
Seth: And even more to the point-
David: Yep
Seth: ... if you're not bought in yet-
David: [laughs]
Seth: ... the prophets predict the fall of their kings.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: I, I don't know if every time-
David: Oh my gosh
Seth: ... but-
David: Constantly
Seth: ... constantly. It's like they f- either the kings will fall because they fail to listen to God's-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... God's word, declared in the prophet, or the prophet will actually declare the end of a particular king, like, um-
David: Yep
Seth: ... Ahab. We're promised that he will fall by somebody's hand in battle.
David: Oh, and, like, is that the one where he'll get, like, eaten by vultures, or is that somebody else?
Seth: Well, there's that one. There's like-
David: There's another one. Yeah. [laughs]
Seth: There's all sorts of weird prophecies where like, "No, you'll get struck by an arrow randomly," or, "You'll die-"
David: Oh
Seth: ... "and you'll get, the dogs will lick up your blood."
David: Yeah. Or like, "Oh, you're gonna get sick and die, and you won't recover."
Seth: Yeah, like-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... the, the prophets-
David: Yep
Seth: ... drive the plot forward-
David: Oh, yeah
Seth: ... in the Book of Kings.
David: Yep.
Seth: So kings-
David: Showing ultimately that God is king.
Seth: Showing ultimately that God is king.
David: God is in control.
Seth: The Book of Kings-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... is a book about the prophetic word of the Lord leading to the true king.
David: Right.
Seth: Which is really easy to see Jesus in just that broad-
David: Mm-hmm. Yes
Seth: ... idea of what is the Book of Kings as prophetic literature pointing at the reign of the true king.
David: Yes, because in the same way that the prophets came to the kings and said, "Trust God. You are not enough. Your obedience is not enough. Your leadership is not enough. The temple's not enough. Your, like, the law is not enough. Like, we're gonna show again and again and again how you, you can't save yourself. Trust in the Lord," they came, the prophets came to the kings to do that. The Book of Kings then prophetically comes to us today and tells us to trust God alone.
Seth: Yes.
David: Like, it's a, it's a prophecy to us, pleading with us-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... to throw our trust upon God.
Seth: That's exactly right. That's exactly right. And then, like, yes. And so maybe before we, like, do the Jesus, the Jesus turn and say, "Oh, Jesus is the prophet who proclaims the reign of the true king-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... God," which he does.
David: Yes.
Seth: Uh, but what then was the message of the prophets?
David: Mm.
Seth: So if the book is primarily prophetic literature-What are the prophets saying?
David: Yeah. I think the prophets are saying, and this, we have to bring up something else here, the prophets are saying, um, that the, that the kings need to stop offering divided worship. That's the, that's the-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... ultimate problem in the book of Kings, is that the kings are worshiping foreign false gods, and they're bringing idols into their land, they're worshiping the gods of the Canaanites.
Seth: Yeah.
David: And so the prophets will tell them, like, to stop. [laughs]
Seth: Right.
David: Yeah. And so I think it's divided worship, ultimately.
Seth: Yeah. So there's like what, "Hey, you're doing this. Stop it."
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: But the, the, the, the prophetic message isn't just, "You're doing wrong. Stop it."
David: Oh, right.
Seth: It's, "Here's how you escape."
David: Yes.
Seth: And so a lot of the times, I think we read the book of Kings or the book of Samuel or a lot of prophetic literature, a lot of scripture in general, and just say, "Oh, Israel's done badly. Israel th- therefore needs to get its act together."
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: "Otherwise, it will die."
David: Right.
Seth: That's kind of the way we read it. It's like, "Oh, Jeremiah said this."
David: Uh-huh.
Seth: "If Israel repents-
David: Right
Seth: ... everything will go back to normal again." That, I don't actually think that's what the prophets say in the book of Kings.
David: No, I don't think so either.
Seth: I think the real message of the book of Kings is that Israel has already sinned.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Therefore, Israel must die, and its only hope to live again-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... is to trust in God, who gives new life.
David: That's right.
Seth: Like-
David: Which is, yeah, which is why, like at the center of this book almost, we, we have the very first resurrection account.
Seth: Yep.
David: It's a miracle-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... that Elijah performs. Um, someone dies, and he's raised to life.
Seth: A little boy dies-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... and he's raised from the dead.
David: Yeah.
Seth: It's the first time we have a resurrection in-
David: That's right
Seth: ... the entire scripture, and it's the, and, and it's in the middle-
David: Right
Seth: ... of the Book of Kings.
David: And then, and then, like-
Seth: Elisha does the same thing
David: ... Elisha does the same thing. Uh, and even Elisha's dead bones in the ground are, someone, someone's dead body is tossed in alongside Elisha's bones. They touch Elisha's dead bones-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... and they're raised to life.
Seth: Yes.
David: And it's like resurrection, I mean, we're, we're a little calloused-
Seth: To resurrection
David: ... to resurrection miracles.
Seth: Right.
David: And, like-
Seth: That's right.
David: We as Christians-
Seth: As Christians, we're like, "Jesus."
David: We're like, "God."
Seth: Right.
David: "It's dead."
Seth: "Happen all the time." [laughs]
David: If you're a Jewish person in this time, like this is, this is groundbreaking-
Seth: Right
David: ... and breaks a lot of categories.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: And it's like, wait, what? You can... I mean, think about the psalmist. Think about David. It's like, "Once I go to Sheol, that's it. Once I go to the grave, that's it."
Seth: Yeah.
David: And it's like, wait, this guy went to the grave and came back? Like, what? [laughs]
Seth: It's a big deal.
David: So yeah, anyway, I just wanted to highlight, yes.
Seth: Yeah. So the-
David: That Israel must die because they have broken the law.
Seth: What the prophets are gonna proclaim over and over again, and then what the narrative of Kings itself says is that Israel has sinned already.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Therefore, Israel is already dead.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Therefore, they must cling to God, who raises the dead.
David: That's right.
Seth: And then you see that in the actions of the prophet Elijah and Elisha, who literally raises two boys-
David: Yep
Seth: ... from the dead, and then a dead man is thrown to bones and then r- risen to life again.
David: Out of a grave.
Seth: Out of a grave. Like-
David: Yep
Seth: ... the, the, uh, uh, well, o- o- one of our sources, his name's Peter Leithart, he says, like, the, the, the, the message of the Book of Kings is evangelistic.
David: Right.
Seth: It's meant to convince us that God is the God that raises the dead.
David: Right.
Seth: Nations, peoples, dynasties, prophets, temples-
David: Yep
Seth: ... wisdom-
David: Yep. Because-
Seth: ... bring us death-
David: Because if-
Seth: ... but God can bring us life.
David: Right, because at the end of the book-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... the temple of God is destroyed.
Seth: Yes.
David: Like, the temple of God. So i- like, in an, in the Israelites' mind, um, in its wor- like, I guess in its... Like, at worst, is thinking God is dead.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Like, God's been defeated by Murdoch, the king-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... the, the God of the Canaanites. You know?
Seth: Yeah. In the ancient Israelite mi- in the ancient mind-
David: In the ancient mind, yeah
Seth: ... gods were connected to land.
David: That's right.
Seth: So when you have a king like the king of Babylon coming in and taking everybody out of Israel, it ki- it functionally in that society, it would've meant God is dead.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And then people will even bring that up in Ezra and Nehemiah-
David: Yep
Seth: ... when, uh, Sennacherib. Sena-
David: Sennacherib.
Seth: Sennacherib comes and, like, mocks Israel, saying, "We've already overtaken you once. We'll do it again. Our gods are better than your God."
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Like, that's what was happening.
David: Oh, yeah. Well, he, he shows up in Kings.
Seth: Oh, he does?
David: Yes.
Seth: Oh, so that's right.
David: Sennacherib in Kings.
Seth: Yes, that's right. He-
David: It's just a really long book.
Seth: It's a long book.
David: Yeah. [laughs]
Seth: I keep getting messed up.
David: Yeah. Sennacherib comes to Hezekiah a second time and mocks that he's done this before-
Seth: That's right
David: ... and then Hezekiah trusts God.
Seth: Right.
David: And then God kills Sennacherib, right-
Seth: So the point we're saying here-
David: ... his, his troops. Yep
Seth: ... is, like, there is this, the message of the prophets-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... is that life comes after death.
David: Yes.
Seth: And that is a kind of a revolution-
David: Yes
Seth: ... in what we've read so far. We get hints and little pieces-
David: Mm-hmm. We do
Seth: ... as we've read through the story so far, but the idea of resurrection life, like life coming after death, is a unique contribution Kings makes to our understanding of what God does in human history.
David: Yeah.
Seth: And obviously, this is sh- shown in Jesus.
David: Right.
Seth: I mean, explicitly, he rises from the dead. [laughs]
David: Yes.
Seth: Like, like, the-
David: Yeah. And, and he, he's the k- he's the ruling king-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... the coming prophet, right, who brings life out of death.
Seth: He's the prophet whose bones bring new life.
David: That's right. When we touch his bones-
Seth: Yeah, we, we-
David: ... in the grave-
Seth: ... bring-
David: ... through our baptism-
Seth: Yes
David: ... we spring to life.
Seth: That's exactly right.
David: 'Cause we're thrown into the grave with him.
Seth: He's the king who dies, but through his death brings the r- like, his new kingdom. And then I al- also wanna like d- like, Kings also, this, Kings is so fun, Sean.
David: It is.
Seth: So we have this idea of a prophet who dies.
David: Yep.
Seth: We have the idea of a king who dies-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... and resurrection coming from those things. There's also other really important categories of things that die in the Book of Kings.
David: Mm.
Seth: So wisdom.
David: Oh, yep.
Seth: The first 11 chapters are all about Solomon and the famous story of Solomon asking for wisdom and God giving him wisdom-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... and then ruling the nation with wisdom. It actually takes up more of any narrative in there. It's all about wisdom.
David: Yeah.
Seth: What's crazy about that is wisdom doesn't work.
David: It fails.
Seth: It dies.
David: Yep.
Seth: Wisdom s- through Solomon was perfectly executed-
David: Yep
Seth: ... presumably.
David: Presumably.
Seth: And it's not enough.
David: Right.
Seth: Even as you've already said, the temple is set-
David: The temple
Seth: ... is set up by Solomon.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And this, the temple, God's presence dwelling in Israel... dies as it's carted off to other nations.
David: Right.
Seth: It's not enough to save Israel. Kings are not enough to save Israel. Temple is not enough to save Israel. Wisdom dies d- and even obeying the law dies.
David: Right. The thing that said, the, the thing that offered life, and even at the beginning of Kings, it says, "If you just obey this, you'll have life in, in the land."
Seth: Yes.
David: And it, it fails.
Seth: Yeah. Like-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... yeah. Uh, and David tells his s- uh tells Solomon, "If you just follow the Lord's commands, you will live."
David: Yeah.
Seth: But he, uh-
David: I love this next-
Seth: ... and what breaks that is, like, Josiah.
David: Mm.
Seth: At the very, very end of Israel's history, Josiah is this good king who we're told obeys the laws-
David: Right
Seth: ... of the Lord-
David: He's-
Seth: ... institutes reform and revival.
David: He's prophesied at the beginning of the book.
Seth: He's prophesied at the beginning of the book, and he comes and he obeys the law perfectly and what happens? Exile.
David: Yep.
Seth: I shouldn't have smacked the table.
David: That was very loud.
Seth: But that was very loud. I'm excited.
David: [laughs]
Seth: The point is-
David: Yep
Seth: ... the Book of Kings is showing us that, like, the Torah-
David: Mm
Seth: ... can't save Judah from destruction.
David: Right.
Seth: Like, there is no refuge in the temple. It's burned by the Babylonian king.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Everything that makes Israel Israel, wisdom, Torah, temple-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... a Davidic lineage, all dies so that God can bring life in Jesus.
David: That's right.
Seth: That's the evangelistic push.
David: That's why it's evangelistic, is because it, it routes out every other, like, path to salvation you could possibly try to find. Like, it-
Seth: Right
David: ... it leaves you with only Jesus.
Seth: Right. And so and what does Jesus do in his life?
David: Mm.
Seth: He says, "In, I have come to fulfill the law. I have demonstrated-
David: And the prophets
Seth: ... the law and the prophets. I, I've lived out what Kings said died."
David: Mm.
Seth: He is true wisdom incarnate.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: What are we told, like, after he di- he grow- uh, when he was born? He, uh, like, the only b- verse about Jesus's adolescence is like, "He grew in wisdom and in stature."
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And then Paul reflecting on Jesus's cross and resurrection will call it the power of God-
David: And the wisdom
Seth: ... and the wisdom of God. Who is the c- who, where is the wisdom that resurrects us from the dead? Jesus.
David: Yes.
Seth: Where's the Torah and the prophets that raises us from the dead? Jesus.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Who is the king of all the earth who dies and raises us to sit with him as his right hand-
David: Who is the Son of David
Seth: ... who is the Son of David? It's Jesus. [laughs]
David: Yeah.
Seth: The book of Kings is, like, pushing us towards the fact that-
David: Yes
Seth: ... there's, life does come after death, but that death must be Jesus'.
David: [Instrumental music] All right. So I think there's another really big theme that's happening, um, in Kings that is a little crazy, but it's, it's, it's kinda like my favorite thing right now. Um-
Seth: Continue.
David: So-
Seth: I'm, I'm in for crazy
David: ... you're, you're all in for crazy.
Seth: I'm in for crazy.
David: Okay. Uh, it's not, it's not, um, what's the word I'm looking for here? Uh, unique to us, so [laughs] it's not like we discovered something. This is something that everyone sees for the most part. Uh, we're just bringing it to attention, and I just think it's crazy. [laughs] So, um, there are all these hints and callbacks and, um, refrains being repeated that remind us of the Garden of Eden-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... and the first three chapters of the Bible. Um, and, a- and, and so, like, as we've said before, th- this is supposed to be the next Eden project. Like, God's plan has always been to dwell with his people, right?
Seth: Yeah.
David: And so now we have a land. The people have a land. The people a, a, have peace, you know? And-
Seth: The promises to Abraham have been fulfilled.
David: Yep. And so now where's the presence? Like, it's time for God's presence to come back into the land and for Eden to be restored. And so, uh, a big part of that's the temple, you know?
Seth: Yeah.
David: Um, but, uh, you have, uh, Solomon, he, he, he has this very famous story, right?
Seth: Solomon 3?
David: Uh, in, in Kings 3.
Seth: So [laughs] Solomon 3.
David: Yeah, Solomon 3.
Seth: K- before you do Solomon 3-
David: Yep
Seth: ... can I set you up even better-
David: Oh
Seth: ... for what you're about to do?
David: Please do.
Seth: So in, in 1 Kings 2-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... David is instructing Solomon about how he should live his life, how he should rule the kingdom.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And he starts with a series of seven.
David: Oh.
Seth: Should ring Creation bells in your head.
David: Ding-a-ling-a-ling.
Seth: Uh, and he says, he says this, "I'm about to go the way of all the Earth. Be strong and show yourself a man," which is a repetition of Joshua-
David: Yes
Seth: ... which is interesting. Uh, but anyway, he says, "Keep charge of the Lord your God, walking his ways and keeping his statutes, his commandments, his rules, his testimonies, as is written in the Law of Moses." That's seven different ways to describe the Torah.
David: Mm.
Seth: And then he says, "So that you may prosper in all that you do and wherever you turn."
David: Mm.
Seth: And that word prosper is back from Genesis, uh, 2-
David: Mm
Seth: ... uh, sor- from 3:6, when God describes when, uh, they will be prosperous in the land, they'll succeed in the land wherever they go.
David: Oh, okay.
Seth: So David tells, "How do you create the new Eden, Solomon?"
David: Uh-huh. Obey the Torah.
Seth: "Obey the Torah-
David: Uh-huh
Seth: ... and you will see Eden come alive-
David: Mm
Seth: ... in your kingship."
David: Yep.
Seth: So he's teaching his son good advice. The Torah is the tree of life.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: When he obeys, eats its fruit, does it, he'll see success in his land.
David: Yes.
Seth: That's what's, that's what David tells his son.
David: Yes. And yet also in the opening two chapters, to s- e- further set up the Eden metaphor-
Seth: Yes, yes
David: ... we, we have a repetition in, uh, 2 Kings 1:4, uh, and 1 Kings 2:14, so, uh, only at the beginning here.
Seth: Yep.
David: 1 Kings 2, 2... Sorry. 1 Kings 2:42.
Seth: 2:42.
David: You have, um, the first r- r- repeat, I believe, I, I think I looked this up, the first repeat of this really important phrase, um,
Seth: The k- uh, in, in English it says, "The king sent and summoned Shimei and said to him, 'Did I not make you swear by the Lord and Solomon swear to you, saying, 'Know for certain on the day you go out and you go to any place whatever, you shall die?'"
David: You shall die, or some of your translations might say, "You shall surely die."
Seth: Okay.
David: Which if that sets off alarm bells in your head, it should, because it's what God told Adam and EveAbout the tree of knowledge
Seth: Mm.
David: He said, "If you eat, the day you eat of that tree of the knowledge of good and evil, you shall surely die." And it's that day you shall surely die.
Seth: Okay.
David: "Be-yom mut tamut" is the- is the Hebrew phrasing of that.
Seth: So we have David repeating, like eat from the tree of life, seven-
David: Uh-huh
Seth: ... days of creation wisdom, choose life then you'll succeed, and then we have a curse pronounced or a- a-
David: Uh-huh
Seth: ... warning, a d-
David: Right. Which is die
Seth: ... if- if you do- do otherwise-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... dying you will die.
David: Dying you will die.
Seth: Which is the literal translation, right?
David: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Seth: Dying.
David: Dying you will die. And so, uh-
Seth: Oh
David: ... that day, dying you will die.
Seth: Okay.
David: And so you have that, and it's repeated again at the beginning of 2 Kings. And so it's like it's said a couple times, and then it's- it's again in 2 Kings 8:10. So three times in the book of Kings you have this unique Genesis curse.
Seth: Interesting.
David: Dying you shall die. So anyway, alarm bells are going off for Eden, and then we get to Solomon. And, um, he is already-
Seth: Will he eat from the tree of life-
David: Yeah, yeah
Seth: ... or the tree of the knowledge of good and evil?
David: Right. Both are set before him.
Seth: Right.
David: Yes.
Seth: Well, you can die and eat from this tree or you can have life and have creation and Eden right before you right here.
David: If you eat from the tree of the Torah.
Seth: And so that's when he makes that prayer, right?
David: Right. So he's at the Ark of the Covenant, right, which is a extremely like-
Seth: Uh, he- I think-
David: ... significant thing. Is that-
Seth: Is that- is that where he's at? I think he goes to, uh, where the tabernacle is-
David: Okay
Seth: ... where- where Moses and Sa- and Joshua set up the tabernacle.
David: Okay.
Seth: Yes.
David: Regardless-
Seth: Yes, regardless
David: ... he has this dream and God visits him in this dream, and basically gives him like a one-wish genie moment, you know? [laughs]
Seth: It is weird, yeah. Yeah. [laughs]
David: And he's like, "Ask me of anything, you know, and you can have it." And he says, "Okay, I want to know tov en ra, good and evil."
Seth: W- is that the same words used in Genesis?
David: It's the exact same words used in Genesis.
Seth: So it's like, so the- the t- the tree of-
David: The tree of tov en ra. Like-
Seth: Okay. So there's a tree of life-
David: Yep
Seth: ... and then there's the tree of tov en ra, the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.
David: Yep.
Seth: Those are the two trees in Genesis.
David: Those are the two trees.
Seth: Okay.
David: And so he asked to know good and evil. And-
Seth: So-
David: Yeah. [laughs]
Seth: But shouldn't he wanna know life? He-
David: He- he should wanna know life.
Seth: So is it a bad thing?
David: So it's confusing. It's... And it's... I think it's intentionally confusing, and we'll get there, but we have to back up a little bit-
Seth: Okay
David: ... to know why it's confusing.
Seth: Okay.
David: So-
Seth: 'Cause what I- what I'm-
David: Yeah. [laughs]
Seth: ... hearing so far is that, okay, hints of Genesis.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Solomon, if you do right, Genesis will be recreated.
David: Yep.
Seth: Eden will come here. Don't die. Don't transgress the law. Don't die.
David: Right.
Seth: Don't eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. Eat of the tree of life. Follow the Torah.
David: Right.
Seth: And then when he's offered the opportunity to ask for anything he wants, he-
David: He asks for the knowledge of good and evil. [laughs]
Seth: Which is, should be, that's the wrong tree.
David: That's the wrong tree. [laughs]
Seth: [laughs] Okay.
David: Yeah.
Seth: Okay.
David: Now, but n- so, but it's- but it's confusing, okay?
Seth: Yeah.
David: Because God, for one, God says he asked for a good thing, right?
Seth: Right.
David: He asked for g- he asked for wisdom.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Right? And so, and then God-
Seth: And then God gives him all this other stuff
David: ... gives him everything else. He gives him the Lamborghini and the big house too-
Seth: Got it
David: ... you know, in a sense.
Seth: Yes.
David: Uh, but what's... But you have to kinda go back and remember what was the offering that the tree of the knowledge of good and evil made to one-
Seth: Make one wise
David: ... to Eve, right?
Seth: Yeah.
David: To make- to make one wise like God. That was the sin, was to be wise like God, to know good and evil.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: That was the first sin that Adam and Eve committed. And so, but- but- but you have to then understand that then we were put under a curse after that. Like- like humanity can't go back. We've eaten from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.
Seth: Hold on. So is wisdom s- sinful in that respect? Uh-
David: So, yeah
Seth: ... 'cause that's what-
David: I g- I know what you mean. Yeah.
Seth: That's what... 'Cause you said like to- to... It was m- it... The tree was good to make one wise.
David: Right.
Seth: And they were punished for wanting to be wise. I'm also thinking about like Proverbs 1 where it says-
David: Yep
Seth: ... like, "The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom-"
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... and like the pursuit of wisdom is a good thing.
David: Yeah.
Seth: So like-
David: So-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... there's a lot happening here. So the, for Adam and Eve, the idea was that they should just trust God, that they didn't need to have exhaustive knowledge about what he was doing or what every form of goodness looked like or every form of evil looked like, but they just needed to trust that what God had already told them in the garden was enough.
Seth: Fear God.
David: Fear God.
Seth: Keep-
David: That's the beginning of wisdom
Seth: ... keep His commandments.
David: Right.
Seth: And then that's wisdom.
David: Yeah.
Seth: Okay.
David: Not knowing all of good and evil, but just trusting that God has given you what you need-
Seth: Okay
David: ... to navigate the world, uh, and not do evil-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... but do good.
Seth: So the reason why it's a good thing for Solomon to want to know good and evil is because he lives in a world of good and evil.
David: So that's right. So th- so we are now under the curse.
Seth: Right.
David: So now we do live in a world where we know good and evil.
Seth: Right.
David: There are good and evil, and, uh, over and over again throughout the biblical story, we have failed-
Seth: Mm
David: ... to do the good, and instead we've chosen evil. So the Torah comes along, the law comes to us and says, "Here's what's good. Here's what's evil. Because you can't parse it out for yourself, so let me tell you what's good. Let me tell you what's evil." And now this has become a tree of life in the midst of a world of the knowledge of good and evil.
Seth: So in a sense, like the Torah is a, is a s- in a sense the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. It like t- it explains why s- things are good and why things are bad, and when you follow that knowledge of good and evil, God's knowledge of good and evil-
David: It's a- it's a tree of life in the middle of... It's- it's-
Seth: Mm
David: ... one tree in the middle of a world of trees of the knowledge of good and evil.
Seth: Okay.
David: 'Cause the tree of the knowledge of good and evil isn't just knowing right and wrong. It's seeking to- to choose right and wrong apart from God-
Seth: Right
David: ... to define the terms yourself.
Seth: Right. B- yes. Yeah, 'cause Adam and Eve like knew what was right and wrong, but they-
David: In God's eyes
Seth: ... in God's eyes.
David: Yes.
Seth: But they just cho- they wanted to do it themselves, like, "No, no, what's right for me is that I know both tov en ra, both good and evil."
David: That's right.
Seth: So the reason why Solomon's request is good then-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... is because he knows he lives in a cursed world.
David: Yes.
Seth: He knows there's evil and good around him, and he wants to know the difference in order that he might do the right thing-
David: Yes
Seth: ... and fear God well.
David: That's-
Seth: That's- that's the reason why
David: ... that's the reason why it's good. But it's tinged, you know, with this like re-Weird-
Seth: Could it be bad?
David: ... could it be bad question that should resound in a Hebrew mi- a Hebrew's mind, I think
Seth: Mm.
David: That it's like, man, I rem- I remember the last time I read these words and someone who ate from that tree, didn't go well for them.
Seth: Yeah. And then I guess to your, to that point is the, the beginning narratives-
David: Yes
Seth: ... with David and Solomon is a little strange.
David: It's strange.
Seth: They ha- Like, there, there's these like series of like political assassinations-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... that, uh, Solomon and David commit together.
David: Yes.
Seth: Which in some sense makes sense.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: It's like there's these enemies to the throne that they're knocking off.
David: Yeah.
Seth: So the-
David: But some of them seem capricious.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Other times it seems like David is obeying the letter of the vows he's made to people. You know, he's like, "Well, I won't kill this person, but I'll have Solomon kill him." And it's like, hmm.
Seth: That's-
David: Was that good or bad? Well, he didn't do it wrong, but it wasn't merciful. And so it's just like, it's weird.
Seth: Yeah.
David: You know, there's this, there's this like these, the seeds of distrust and tension of is the opening of Kings good or bad? Is it tov or is it rah?
Seth: Well, and even in Solomon 3, right before he asks-
David: Yes
Seth: ... uh, for wisdom, we're told that he marries one of Pharaoh's daughter.
David: Yes. So before he repeats Genesis, he repeats Exodus.
Seth: Which, yeah.
David: Which he, so he becomes, and we're gonna see him become even after he gets tov and rah, after, after he eats from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, we're gonna see that he becomes more like Pharaoh than like David.
Seth: Because eventually he'll amass Egyptian horses and chariots.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: He'll make up a whole bunch of slaves of the other nations and even his own people.
David: His own people.
Seth: So, okay.
David: So, so Solomon, I, I, I think, I think, I'm sure a lot of people listening have a romanticized view of Solomon-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... and this beautiful request for wisdom instead of riches.
Seth: And here it's, it's all-
David: It's a good thing
Seth: ... it's a good thing. It is good.
David: But it is tinged with-
Seth: And maybe the thing-
David: ... like discord
Seth: ... that we should take away from that, even just like practically, is that wisdom can kinda cut both ways.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Like, the ability to know good from evil and to understand the way the cursed world works, which I guess is what Solomon is asking-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... to understand, can be used to honor God, or it can be used to honor yourself-
David: Right
Seth: ... and to use to further your own agenda.
David: Right.
Seth: Which is what exactly what happened to Solomon.
David: Yes.
Seth: It's used to consolidate his power. He amasses over 700 wives. It's used to make-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... treaties with all these other nations and eventually ends to his downfall.
David: Yeah.
Seth: So, like, wisdom isn't a neutral good.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: It's like, oh, the, the, the knowing good from evil isn't neutral.
David: It's a neutral. It's a neutral good.
Seth: It is truly neutral.
David: Satan showed craftiness or wisdom-
Seth: Right
David: ... in the garden.
Seth: It's like it's a neutral-
David: That's right
Seth: ... and then whether or not you honor God or don't honor God-
David: That's right
Seth: ... is important.
David: So let me add one more hue of color-
Seth: Okay
David: ... to this because this is especially for spoken gospel and my personal convictions that I think at the heart of every sin is legalism. [laughs]
Seth: Okay.
David: I wanna point this out, that there are some commentators, uh, and I think they argue it convincingly, I'm reading a guy called Provan, um, and, and he, uh, and others argue that Solomon's request was legalistic, that he wanted to know good and evil, right? So that-
Seth: Right
David: ... he could perfectly obey the Torah, so that he could save Israel from the punishment he knew was coming. If, if, like you said earlier, Israel must die, and Solomon, having read Deuteronomy, knows this to be true because of their past, and Israel must be exiled, must be killed, then he's thinking that if he knows perfectly good and evil, then he can perfectly follow the Torah and earn God's favor for Israel.
Seth: And that's been the good news throughout the Torah, right? Like, if you do well, you'll be blessed in the land, you'll live long, you'll prosper, and you'll eat milk and honey. Like, the, the, the, the, the hope has been if you obey the, the Torah-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... you'll be, you'll, you'll, you'll be saved, you'll be successful, right? So he's doing the right thing by wanting that, right?
David: Kind of. Uh, I think the hope of the Torah is love God, is the hope of Deuteronomy. Love God, and then you will obey him. He doesn't ask for love of God. Like, you know [laughs] like-
Seth: Right
David: ... and, and so, like, he's, i, I think he's taking... A- and, uh, s- strikingly missing from all of these, um, repeats of the 2 Samuel 7 promise that God made to David is God's eternal, unbreaking, everlasting promise that he will do it even in the midst of Solomon or whoever his son would be's sins.
Seth: Yeah.
David: And so it's just, the only thing that's highlighted by David and by Solomon is obey and you'll do well.
Seth: Mm.
David: And that's it.
Seth: Yeah.
David: There's, there's no grace there.
Seth: Mm.
David: And, and God sh- has grace in his promise, and it's forgotten by this time.
Seth: Interesting. So what you're saying is, like, Solomon is trying to earn God's salvation rather than trusting God himself?
David: That's right, which that goes back to the Garden of Eden for me, because I'm convinced, and I've written about this in my book, "Rewire Your Heart," that Eve's sin at the tree of the knowledge of good and evil was legalistic, that she wanted to know good and evil so that she could earn, earn further God's kingdom in the garden instead of just trusting that what he said was enough.
Seth: Hmm.
David: That she wanted to do more herself.
Seth: Interesting.
David: Yeah.
Seth: 'Cause I think I've been reading the Torah so far as, like, good news in and of itself. Like, to an Israelite-
David: Yes
Seth: ... in that period of time, if you obey the law-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... it will go well for you. You will experience God's goodness and favor. So love God and keep his commandments.
David: But I think, I think that's the, one of the ways to read the law-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... right? But I'm, as the Torah, as a whole story, the good news of the Torah is that God saves before we do anything good. He saved Israel before they obeyed the covenant. Before there was a covenant, he saved. He chose Abraham before he had done anything good.Right? And so, like, the news of the, the good news of the Torah is that God is gracious, that God is love.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: And we're gonna see that play out in Kings as he-
Seth: Right
David: ... continues his long-suffering with these terrible kings and then the Torah is how to live in right relationship with that God-
Seth: Interesting
David: ... who you're obeying because you love.
Seth: Okay. So then let's just, let's just take that at face value then. So if we're s- and the reason we're spending so much time here-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... I should just flag. It's like, well, why are we talking about wisdom in the middle of this? Like, the first 11 chapters-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... of the Book of Kings is centered around Solomon, this request for wisdom, and the building of his temple.
David: Right.
Seth: It's, it's really central to the first 11 chapters. It's the longest period of time spent in the Book of Kings on a particular king.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And then how does that idea about wisdom and trying to follow God or not following God play out across the rest of the book? 'Cause I think that's the question I'm asking at this point.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Say, okay, I wanna understand the intricacies of wisdom, but wait, isn't that Proverbs? Isn't that Ecclesiastes?
David: Right.
Seth: Isn't that-
David: No, 'cause it's gonna play out again and again, right? That, in Solomon asking for wisdom, we get, we get the point of the whole book, is that wisdom is listening to the voice of the Lord in order to do good instead of bad.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: And we're going to see again and again that there are kings who do not listen to the voice of the Lord or the lips of the prophets, and therefore, it goes bad for them.
Seth: Yeah. And then back to our original point, even when kings do obey-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... like Josiah-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... it doesn't actually save them.
David: Right.
Seth: It doesn't prevent exile from coming.
David: Right.
Seth: So to your point in saying, like, doing what the law commands has never been enough.
David: Right.
Seth: There's always been a prior act of God's salvation, like saving Israel from Egypt-
David: Yes
Seth: ... before the law was even instituted.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And so even here, where it seems as if the hope is do well, be wise, and it'll go well for you, it just seems to break.
David: The real hope should have been God will have an everlasting king-
Seth: Mm
David: ... on the throne of David.
Seth: And then, uh-
David: You just need to trust that. It's going to happen graciously because of his everlasting covenant, not because you earned it.
Seth: And so in, so in that, so in that ev- leaning into the evangelistic theme-
David: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm
Seth: ... we picked up, like, human wisdom must die-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... in order for true wisdom to rise.
David: Yes.
Seth: And so in Jesus, we get that same type of turn, right? Like-
David: Yes
Seth: ... human wisdom s- would say the king shouldn't die. Human wisdom would say that Jesus lived a perfect life, and so he should have been-
David: Mm
Seth: ... like, elevated and rewarded for what good that he did-
David: Right
Seth: ... and not experience injustice. But when human wisdom dies, when it's proven to be inefficient or ineffective in bringing about God's kingdom, we're shown true wisdom that God brings life from the dead. And when you trust God more than your own wisdom and your own determination between right and wrong, you will be raised, too.
David: Right, yes.
Seth: That's it.
David: It is, and I think we can highlight that even more by f- by, by knowing that Solomon, uh, is a new Adam, you know? He's the new Adam who eats from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, hopefully for good this time, right? Uh, and all his children after him are the rest of the kings, and they f- they are made in his image, in a sense. And, um, he has all wisdom. He has all knowledge, right? He's a, in a sense, a better person than you and I could ever be 'cause he just knows more. You know, he knows the intricacies of the world better.
Seth: He has a God-given gift for wisdom that we don't have. But wait, don't, like, but hold it.
David: Well, we do. We, we'll get there.
Seth: Hold, yeah, yeah. [laughs]
David: We'll get there. Uh, and so what I'm saying is, I, I, I just wanna say, like, we all wanna be the exception to the rule of legalism, that everyone thinks that... Like, when, when I say you can't save yourself, you know, people automatically think, "Well, like, I'm not that bad," or like, "I'm actually pretty good," or like, we all think that we'll be the exception. And Solomon, being the new Adam who has all wisdom and is, could have been the best person ever, he failed. And so no one is exempt from the curse-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... at all. Like... [laughs]
Seth: Yeah, the Davidic king-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... who is the descendant of Eve, who's supposed to be the snake crusher, who knows all wisdom and who knows all bad can't actually save.
David: Yeah. You cannot save yourself through good works. You cannot.
Seth: You cannot s- and to wisdom.
David: Yeah.
Seth: You cannot save yourself through wisdom-
David: Right
Seth: ... through knowing enough, understanding the world enough.
David: Yep.
Seth: It's, it's, it's a futile exercise to, to go off your own determinations of right and wrong.
David: That's right.
Seth: It will not save you.
David: Right. Which is why, as you were getting at, the Holy Spirit is such good news that comes to us because that is the, the knowledge, the mind of God coming to us, helping us know right from wrong, like, to choose good over evil, and actually can override our sinful inclinations.
Seth: I haven't thought about, like, the Holy Spirit, like, coming into us as, like, the same type of gift that Solomon gets here.
David: Mm.
Seth: It's like Sol- like, or even, like, when we ask for the Spirit, or when we seek first the kingdom of God, all these things are added to us.
David: Yes.
Seth: In the same way, like, the, the, like, Solomon seeks wisdom here, and everything else is g- granted to him.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: When, and when Jesus prays, "Your kingdom come, your will be done," in the Beatitudes, he even says, like, th- this gift is the Holy Spirit.
David: Mm.
Seth: Like, the way in which we get the whole kingdom is by having the deposit of wisdom-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... which is the Holy Spirit living inside of us.
David: Right, which is why in the Sermon on the Mount, Jesus, right around that same time, says that all the grass in the field is clothed i- in a way that Solomon was never even clothed.
Seth: Oh, he-
David: Like, he, he flags Solomon for us-
Seth: Right
David: ... in that context, that, like, the Holy Spirit is what adds everything. [laughs]
Seth: And so I think what's also good news about that, I think we talked about this back in one of our Ecclesiastes podcasts-
David: Mm
Seth: ... about, like, how Solomon had to ask for the, the discernment to, to choose between good and evil.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: But will it, choosing between good and evil based on your knowledge fails-
David: Yep
Seth: ... as he sees. What we need instead is a new inclination or new intuition on what is good by default. We need new default settings in our heart.
David: Right.
Seth: And so when the Holy Spirit comes, he gives us something better than what Solomon had.
David: Mm.
Seth: If Solomon had the ability to know good and evil, we have the spirit of the tree of life inside of us-
David: Mm
Seth: ... who gives us hearts that desire and are pulled towards good-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... all the time without having to explore evil.
David: Right.
Seth: 'Cause I think that's part of the other issue. It's like, I, I mean, I've, I, as a pastor, like, I talk to all these kids with, like, decades-long, you know, porn addictions and stuff.
David: Yeah.
Seth: And I just never struggled with that on the same level, so I was always like, "Man, I can'tHelp them-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... because I haven't experienced the depth of their pain, or I haven't experienced the same thing that they have. No. Solomon would say, the Holy Spirit would say, "No, you don't need that." When you have the knowledge of the Holy Spirit, the indwelling Holy Spirit within s- inside of you, your heart tends towards the tree of life so that you-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... can lead others towards the tree of life. You don't need to know evil to speak against evil, to draw people out of evil. All you need is the Holy Spirit dwelling inside of you, and you can escape the cycle that we see in Kings.
David: Right. And that is a big deal, um, to name real quick, that the cycle we see in Kings are, you have good kings and you have bad kings, but no king, save really Josiah, um, uh, obeys God with their whole heart. Uh, because even good kings, like Hezekiah, you know, they, they tear down, um, you know, idol- places of idol worship and false gods, and they restore worship to the true God of Israel. Um, but there's always this looming problem in Northern Israel, uh, 'cause we'll have to talk about the kingdom split-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... here in a second, uh, that there's a repeat of Exodus, and Jeroboam had erected two golden calves, and no one ever tears them down. You know? [laughs] Like, and so we're always told that, yeah, this king was good, but he didn't obey God with his whole heart because he didn't tear down the golden calves that Jer- that Jeroboam erected in Northern Israel. And so it's like there's this problem that even the best kings, even those who, who do right in the eyes of the Lord, and it's really good, they fail because there was still one outpost of sin they were unable to conquer. And like, that is the, the, like a g- a big-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... picture of life without a savior like Jesus, and life without the Holy Spirit, is that even given enough time, you know, and your best possible efforts, you would not totally root out sin in your life or the world around you, so much so to deserve salvation from the judgment that you've earned.
Seth: So the, so to close the loop in just the wisdom narrative then.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: So just to, I wa- I wa- I wanna talk about all that using wisdom language.
David: Okay.
Seth: Be- so we have this strong category of wisdom set up-
David: Yep
Seth: ... to show us that our own wisdom, our own determination between good and evil-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... just are insufficient to establish and maintain God's kingdom.
David: Mm.
Seth: We'll need a different type of wisdom placed in our hearts, like Solomon was given a type of wisdom in his heart. Solomon's wisdom was great, but it kinda led him both directions.
David: Yep.
Seth: It was a neutral.
David: Yep.
Seth: It led him to use it either on his own desires or for the desires of God. The wisdom that we're given by the Holy Spirit is not neutral.
David: Mm.
Seth: It tends positively.
David: Right.
Seth: It tends towards the Lord and His law and towards the tree of life, so we're automatically drawn that way. So unlike the kings here, who are always trying to determine what to do or what not to do in their kingdom, and would always leave some outpost of sin somewhere-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... God has given us a deposit of wisdom in the Holy Spirit that always tends towards Him and towards the tree of knowledge of good and evil, so that progressively over the course of our life, there will be no kingdom, no idol left in us as we follow Him.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Like, He's steadily uprooting it with no regression. Like, unlike the kings who experience regression-
David: Mm
Seth: ... progression, in Christ, in the wisdom of the Holy Spirit, we're always pushing back the idolatries in our heart and moving forward and forward, until when we're with the Lord, all those outposts-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... will be taken out. There will be no kingdom and no idolatry left. The Holy Spirit makes us into the wise king Solomon never could be.
David: Yep. I think that's so good, and Solomon nor any king could ever be.
Seth: And it comes through the prophetic message of wisdom-
David: Yes
Seth: ... must die-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... in order for, our human wisdom must die.
David: Right. Which is why, as you said earlier, the pro- the, the message of the prophets wasn't reform your ways and you'll be saved-
Seth: Right
David: ... because you can't.
Seth: That's good.
David: It was, "Death is coming. Trust in the one who will give new life."
Seth: Trust in the Lord.
David: Which is, which is really interesting, too, that when we're told that a, a king does good, like, there's, every, every king is, i- is ascribed a moral judgment. He did what was good in the eyes of the Lord. He did what was bad in the eyes of the Lord. And what's interesting, just from a nerd standpoint-
Seth: Nerd it
David: ... is that when we're told that a king does bad in the sight of the Lord, or does evil in the sight of the Lord, that is ra.
Seth: Oh, the same word from-
David: The same word from Solomon, that Solomon asks-
Seth: Okay
David: ... "I wanna know good and evil." That's evil. But we're never told, even when the king does good, we're never told that he does tov.
Seth: Interesting.
David: So no one gets God's goodness, right, until Jesus, and God then gives us His cho- His tov.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: He gives us His goodness, His righteousness, like something that no king could ever get, even whenever he prayed for it. You know? [laughs] Like-
Seth: That's pretty... Yeah
David: ... Jesus gives us freely, which is just neat.
Seth: It is neat. [laughs]
David: [gentle music] All right, so before we close out this episode, uh, we figured we should actually talk a little bit about what happens in the overarching-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... narrative of this difficult book.
Seth: We've gone through all the themes of, like, what you should expect and what you should see-
David: Yes
Seth: ... and things you should look out for, but the actual story, the history that it actually covers. [laughs]
David: Yes. [laughs] We're like, "Hey, we should talk about that real quick."
Seth: Yeah.
David: Uh, so we wanna do that two ways, really fast. One is we wanna talk about one last theme that will get repeated over and over and over again, and then we wanna put it all in some of the broad historical categories to help you think about as you encounter a bunch of names and places, uh, that will kinda just help frame-
Seth: Yep
David: ... the book as you read through it. So the theme is God's love-
Seth: Yep
David: ... that we wanna talk about.
Seth: I think it's really easy to come to Kings and be like, "Man, God's kinda mad."
David: Mm.
Seth: "He's kinda angry." Or, like, even that idea like, um, the God of the Old Testament's kinda cruel-
David: Right
Seth: ... and vindictive, and the God of the New Testament's all love and mercy-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... and so exciting to be around. Um, that, I don't think that... And I think you will be tempted as you read the book of 1 Kings to emphasize God's judgment of evil kings over His love towards evil kings-
David: Mm
Seth: ... which is actually the more predominant theme throughout the book.
David: And confusing one.
Seth: And the confu- I mean, like, the, for, the really simple example is, uh, King Ahab. Uh, so, or Ahaz.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: So Ahaz replaces the altar of Moses with an altar that he designs for himself, and then puts it in there with his own temple furnishing. It's like-
David: It's like the worst thing
Seth: ... it's like, so you've desecrated God's temple with things that you just thought up.
David: Yep.
Seth: But one,God leaves the temple standing.
David: Yeah.
Seth: His presence presumably is still there and then later on his sons, he... And then later on he will give his himself victory in battle. He'll give Ahaz-
David: Ahaz victory in battle.
Seth: Victory in battle.
David: Like, is that the o- twice?
Seth: Twice.
David: Yeah.
Seth: Bec- And you know why? Ahab, uh-
David: Ahaz
Seth: ... Ahaz repents at one point. He humbles himself before the Lord and the pro- the prophet is, like, rebuking him, and then God rebukes the prophet saying, "No, no, no. Look at him. He repented. You should, we should extend mercy to him."
David: Ugh.
Seth: So you have a man who should not be receiving mercy from God, but is actually given mercy twice-
David: Yes
Seth: ... is acknowledged for his humility, and that is just one example-
David: Yes
Seth: ... of it happening over and over and over again-
David: Right
Seth: ... throughout scripture.
David: One of the com- one of the commentators we read, uh, he said that, uh, by the end of Kings, you shouldn't be thinking like, um, "Man, how could God destroy the temple?" Like, "Man, this is so mean."
Seth: So mean. Yeah.
David: What you should be saying is, "Finally. Finally-
Seth: Here's, here's the-
David: ... their sin caught up with them." [laughs]
Seth: Here's the, here's the quote. Ah, "The impression we get from First and Second Kings is not that God is a stingy disciplinarian with an anger problem. If anything, the God of First and Second Kings is irresponsibly indulgent-
David: Mm
Seth: ... towards his people, a God who does not seem to realize he cannot run the world without a dose of law and order."
David: Mm.
Seth: That's the kind of picture you get. Like, God is, like, letting a whole bunch of junk-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... happen to this nation, and still he puts one of David's sons-
David: Yep
Seth: ... in a royal court by the end of it.
David: Why?
Seth: This God is mismanaging his universe.
David: Right. And so, uh, we have to ask the question, why?
Seth: Why is he-
David: Why would God do this? Like, one, God is love.
Seth: Yeah. [laughs]
David: God is long-suffering and merciful, uh, and kind and compassionate, and he's just putting all that on display. Like, that's just his character, who he is. Uh, the other is because God promised. We're gonna hear over and over and over again that God is going to, um, act in ways that people don't deserve. He's going to act merc- mercifully and graciously because of the promise he made to David, because he-
Seth: That's right
David: ... promised that a king would sit on David's throne, so he can't utterly destroy them. He's always got a... He's always bound by his own word and bound by his own love to leave a shred of hope for Israel-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... and for the whole world. Um, and so it's like God's love wins the day-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... in this, in this book.
Seth: And e- even more explicitly, God's love enthrones-
David: Mm
Seth: ... sinful people.
David: Ugh.
Seth: Ephesians 2.
David: Mm.
Seth: God dies so that we might be seated at his right hand in heavenly places. God's love enthrones sinful people.
David: Yeah. You're talking about... A- and, like, that happens all throughout.
Seth: A- all throughout scripture.
David: But it's at the end. It's Jehoiachin.
Seth: It's Jehoiachin at the very end.
David: And it's like he's the worst.
Seth: He's the worst.
David: He's terrible.
Seth: He's the one that actually... And he's the last one.
David: Yeah.
Seth: He's the last one.
David: He's the last one, and he's enthroned and given a royal meal, and it's like at, in, in, in, like, the lap of luxury. Like, he's in, like, Abu Dhabi or something.
Seth: Yeah. [laughs]
David: You know? Like-
Seth: Yeah, yeah, yeah
David: ... he's, like, living the penthouse life, and it's like, why? He doesn't deserve that. I'm kind of mad at the end of, at the end of Kings. And I'm like, oh, that's what God did to me. Like, I was the worst, and God gave me a throne and a feast through Jesus because he's loving.
Seth: Praise the Lord.
David: That's amazing.
Seth: [laughs] That's pretty cool. That's-
David: That's good.
Seth: That's the end of the book.
David: Yeah.
Seth: So here, so if you were like, "What on earth is actually happening in the Book of Kings?"
David: Yes.
Seth: Here's the story. So this is the broad strokes, themes-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... you should be looking out for. As you read them, just flag them in your Bible. I just underline stuff like that-
David: Okay
Seth: ... and say, "Oh, this is w- something David we're talking about."
David: Yep.
Seth: I don't listen to my own podcast-
David: You don't?
Seth: ... and then read the Bible.
David: Oh, okay. Yeah.
Seth: Uh, normally, like, anyway, regardless.
David: [laughs]
Seth: Just trying to track on with what our, hap- might happening, might be happening in our listeners' lives regardless.
David: Yes.
Seth: The story is-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... David is on the verge of death.
David: Yep.
Seth: And he hands over his throne to Solomon after a coup attempt by his other son, Adonijah.
David: Adonijah.
Seth: Solomon takes the throne, asks for wisdom, establishes God's temple, and then doesn't end up following God's wisdom or God's laws.
David: Right.
Seth: He breaks all the commands that God gave kings in Deuteronomy 7.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Which was read the law every day, don't amass a lot of wives, don't s- amass a lot of fortunes, don't have Egyptian horses, don't have Egyptian wives. He breaks them all.
David: He breaks them all, and then he builds a ton of f- like, false temples for false gods for his wives to go worship in.
Seth: Yep.
David: Like, Solomon is the one who introduces all this pagan worship in the land of Israel.
Seth: And then all of Solomon's sons, for the most part, follow in his fa- his father's footsteps.
David: Right. Th- really important thing that happens.
Seth: Yep.
David: Right? And-
Seth: And so at the very s- and so the very start that, like, leads this whole thing off-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... is there's a civil war-
David: Yes
Seth: ... in Israel after Solomon's death. Rehoboam and Jeroboam.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Explain this part.
David: I can try.
Seth: Yes. [laughs]
David: Uh, so Rehoboam is Solomon's son.Right?
Seth: Yep.
David: Yes. And then Jeroboam is someone that God raises up.
Seth: Jeroboam was the-- He was in charge of all the slaves of Israel.
David: That's right. He was over-- He was like a general of the forced labor.
Seth: Yeah.
David: And he stewarded his people really well.
Seth: Yeah.
David: And so God sends a prophet or a priest, uh, to, uh, Jeroboam and says-- He anoints him just like he did David.
Seth: Yeah.
David: And he anoints him outside of the normal-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... palace practices. So this is like a repeat of the David story, and, like, anoints him. And Jeroboam, he said, "You're going to reign as king." And so, uh, and then he takes a brand-new garment, and he rips it into 12 pieces to represent the 12 tribes of Israel, and he gives 10 of the tribes to Jeroboam, and that-- those 10 tribes, so those are the 10 tribes other than Judah and Benjamin, those, those are the two-- those are-- the other 10 tribes go to Jeroboam, and that constitutes what's called Israel in your copy of Kings. [chuckles]
Seth: Right. And, and-
David: So, so anytime you read the word Israel, it's talking about Jeroboam and his line after him-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... and the northern kingdom, the 10 tribes. Anytime it says Judah-
Seth: It's referring to- [chuckles]
David: ... it's the southern kingdom and Rehoboam's line aft-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... or Solomon's line, if you will-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... after. And that's the-- A- anytime you're in Judah, that is David's line.
Seth: Yep.
David: So that's the, that's the messianic line that you're like, "What's gonna happen there?"
Seth: The one with only two tribes is the messianic line.
David: That's right.
Seth: Judah and Benjamin.
David: Judah and Benjamin are there.
Seth: Yep.
David: And so you're gonna-- we're gonna trace them. And so what's confusing is you're going to read at the beginning of each story, it's gonna say, uh, it's gonna position you, uh, in, in one of the two places.
Seth: Right.
David: You're either gonna find yourself in Israel or in Judah for that story.
Seth: Which is really confusing.
David: Very confusing.
Seth: 'Cause Israel and Judah are the same person if back in [laughs] Genesis.
David: [laughs] Oh, no, no. It's I- Israel.
Seth: Jacob.
David: Jacob.
Seth: Jacob, sorry.
David: Yeah, yeah.
Seth: Anyway.
David: And Judah is one of his sons.
Seth: That's right.
David: Okay, and so, so what's, what's gonna happen is you're gonna need to pay attention to those headings where it's going to say, "During the reign of King blank, the king of Judah, so and so reigned in Israel."
Seth: Yeah.
David: So you'll need to go, "Okay, so I'm in Israel. This is the new king in Israel, and it's during the reign of so and so in Judah."
Seth: Yeah.
David: And so you just need to know, okay, I'm in the north.
Seth: Or-
David: This is, this is Jeroboam's line. This is not the messianic line. And then it's gonna say, "During the reign of King blank, king of Israel, this guy reigned in Judah."
Seth: Yeah.
David: Okay, I'm in Judah. I'm in the southern kingdom.
Seth: Yeah.
David: This is the messianic line. So you're gonna follow these people, and it's gonna overlap. Their stories are all gonna overlap and run together.
Seth: Yeah, you'll, you'll, like, cross-
David: Yep, one king will die halfway through another king's life, and you just have to try to-
Seth: There's two kings named Jeroboam.
David: Keep up.
Seth: Like, it's [laughs]
David: Yeah, so you just have to keep up with usually two kings, maybe three at a time, uh, because you're in two different p- places at a time, and it, it's, it's semi-chrononic, ch- chronological, but sometimes it has to jump back 20 years-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... to be like, "Okay, now that was the end of that northern king's life, but let's rewind 20 years to the southern king's life."
Seth: So a- so after Solomon, what happens-
David: Yes
Seth: ... is there's a civil war.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Uh, Rehoboam, Solomon's son-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... cracks down on all the forced laborers.
David: Oh, yeah, that line is a, is amazing.
Seth: It's, "My, my, uh, my pinky is fatter than my father's waist," and he wants to s-
David: Or his thigh.
Seth: His thigh.
David: Yeah.
Seth: And he wants to whip people not with, uh, whips but with scorpions.
David: Yeah.
Seth: So it's really intense, and then so Jeroboam leads a slave rebellion.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: They don't wanna r- rule that way.
David: No.
Seth: It's [laughs] they don't wanna be ruled that way, so he leads a slave rebellion, and they're in constant conflict.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And you're gonna read all the kings from those two divided nations-
David: Yep
Seth: ... throughout the rest of the book of Kings.
David: That's right.
Seth: And-
David: And something really important happens at that division.
Seth: Yeah.
David: So they, Jeroboam realizes that if, if his people, the 10 tribes of Israel, continually go to Jerusalem in the southern kingdom in Judah to meet with Yahweh and worship him there in the temple, that their hearts will be turned to the southern kingdom, and they will leave his northern kingdom and go to the south.
Seth: Yeah.
David: And so he's afraid that he'll lose, and him and his sons will lose the kingdom. And so what he does is he builds a new temple in the north, and that's where he builds the two golden calves.
Seth: Yeah.
David: So that way, he can control his throne politically through religious means.
Seth: So, and what you'll notice is in the northern kingdom, every king from the northern kingdom is said to be bad.
David: Yep.
Seth: Not one king is told that's good. We're not told one king that follows in the path of David or does what's right in the sight of the Lord. Every king in the north, bad king.
David: Yeah.
Seth: In the south, we get, I think-
David: Mostly bad kings.
Seth: Mostly bad, but there's two that's good, right? Or-
David: There's, there's several good ones.
Seth: We're not, like-
David: We just don't always hear their stories.
Seth: We don't always hear... But we are-- We're, we're-
David: Hezekiah and Josiah are the two heavy hitters.
Seth: And they're near the end.
David: And they're near the end. [laughs]
Seth: And they're near the end. And you'll get, and you'll get to them, and then by the end of the book. And so that basically tracks that history until the civil war dis- dissolves and Babylon comes.
David: Yep, and so what happens in, uh, you'll, you'll see Assyria, um, around the middle of 2 Kings, Assyria will take the northern kingdom into exile. So that was Jeroboam's line. That's where the calves were.
Seth: Okay.
David: That's the northern kingdom. Uh, Assyria takes them into exile, and then years later, the Babylon, B- Babylon and the Babylonians come and take the southern kingdom of Judah in exile, and that's where the book ends.
Seth: Yes.
David: So that's helpful-
Seth: Yes
David: ... to just kinda lay out that's what happens in the book.
Seth: You're watching the fall of the Davidic monarchy.
David: That's right. It's, first it fractures, and then the north part is picked off, and then the southern part is picked off, and then there's nothing left.
Seth: And the pro-
David: Except one evil king on a foreign throne.
Seth: And the prophetic, evangelistic point of all that is Israel must die-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... if it wants to be raised again.
David: And then Jesus, as the new Israel, dies, raises again to bring life to the new kingdom of God.
Seth: To all peoples of the earth.
David: Yeah. So that's, that's Kings.
Seth: That's it. That's the book of Kings. [laughs]
David: [laughs]
Seth: Woo. We did it.
David: How do you feel?
Seth: I feel great, actually. That was, like, really life-giving and fun-
David: Good
Seth: ... and exciting and-
David: It was nice to, we've been studying this one for a long time, and it feels good to actually have just sat down and talked about it.
Seth: It was also, like, the first book that just felt like, man, I just can't keep all the details in my head at once.
David: No, it's a lot.
Seth: Like, I, and the more I studied about Kings, the less I feel, like, really confident in a certain, like, line of interpretation.
David: Yeah.
Seth: But, like, I-
David: 'Cause it just, there's so much happening.
Seth: There's so much happening, and, like, I'm just a man.
David: Yep.
Seth: I'm a limited man with limited brain space.
David: Yeah.
Seth: And I felt myself coming up against it in the book of Kings, but I'm really excited-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... for what we've studied so far.
David: So if you're frustrated in Kings as you read it, we are with you. [laughs]
Seth: We are with you. But if you have any questions, we would love to hear them-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... because we, we want to hear your questions.
David: Yeah, so just, uh, you can email us at [email protected], podcast, singular-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... @spokengospel.com. We'd love to talk to you.
Seth: Yeah, send us a voice message, and hopefully we'll get a chance to do, like, some sort of question and answer-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... thing in the future. And if you haven't already, please, uh, subscribe and, uh, leave us a review. We'd love that.
David: Yeah.
Seth: Let's help other people find Jesus in all scripture.
David: Yeah. So thank you guys for listening. This has been a lot of fun, and, uh, we will see you next week. [outro music]
Outro: Thank you for listening to the Spoken Gospel podcast. Spoken Gospel is a nonprofit that gives all its resources, like this podcast, away for free because of supporters like you. To help Spoken Gospel in our mission to speak the gospel out of every corner of scripture and view all our free resources, visit spokengospel.com. [outro music]