Intro: [upbeat music] Welcome to the Spoken Gospel podcast. Spoken Gospel is a ministry that's dedicated to speaking the gospel out of every corner of scripture. In Luke 24, Jesus told his disciples that every part of the Bible was about him. So each week, hosts David and Seth work through a passage of scripture to see how it's all about Jesus and his good news. Let's jump in. [upbeat music]
David: All right. Well, welcome everyone to a very special episode of the Spoken Gospel podcast. Uh, we are gonna jump back into the Book of Jonah.
Seth: Right.
David: Yeah.
Seth: Just for our podcast audience.
David: Right.
Seth: So-
David: As you remember, we were broadcasting on YouTube, the whole Jonah series, but we were, we... Uh, right after we stopped hitting record on our fourth episode
Seth: We just kept-
David: [laughs]
Seth: ... talking about all the things we missed-
David: Yes
Seth: ... and we're like, "How did we not see this connection-
David: [laughs]
Seth: ... to Jesus?" And it's not on YouTube, but-
David: It's go- that's what happens when you slow down a little bit-
Seth: Yes
David: ... make coffee and think about it. So we were like, "We have to record this just for our podcast audience." So this is our, our Jonah special episode, hyphen-
Seth: What we missed [laughs]
David: [laughs] Only the good stuff, comma, what we missed, colon, only the Jesus turns.
Seth: Only the Jesus turns.
David: [laughs]
Seth: And it's gonna be great.
David: It's, yes.
Seth: Um, so to start off with-
David: Uh-huh
Seth: ... in Jewish tradition-
David: Right
Seth: ... the Book of Jonah was read during the Day of Atonement.
David: Okay. Right. And if, in the Day of Atonement, if you need a refresher course, Leviticus 16, it's the high point, not only of the Book of Leviticus, but of the whole Torah.
Seth: Yeah.
David: And it is the day on which all of Israel's sins are atoned for.
Seth: Right. And so now you have this really fascinating book-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... about read on the Day of Atonement.
David: Right. And it, and it w- and it's, like, a book about atonement for your oppressors.
Seth: Yeah. And in a book that rebukes Israel for their own sin-
David: Uh-huh
Seth: ... personified in the character of Jonah.
David: Right.
Seth: So-
David: Why read this book on the Day of Atonement?
Seth: It's like, this is like, it's like either... It's like, it's a very biting book.
David: Yeah.
Seth: It's like it's a book that convicts everybody there, and that's why they read it, I guess.
David: Oh, oh.
Seth: Like, right.
David: Right, because the, the Day of Atonement, it, it, Leviticus 16 tells you to be somber the whole day.
Seth: Yeah.
David: It's a somber day. And to read this book is to be like, "Oh, not only have I sinned by sinning as my neighbor." It's like w- they're repenting even for their, like, refusal to go bless the nations. Like, they're-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... they're joining themselves-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... with Jonah, identifying themselves with Jonah as a representative of Israel, saying, "Man, maybe we deserve to be cut off from-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... the Promised Land. Maybe we deserved exile. Oh, woe is us. Now we can make a sacrifice."
Seth: Right. So they're repenting. So Jews throughout history would repent for the sin of Jonah.
David: Mm.
Seth: They repented for their failure to extend mercy to their oppressors-
David: Right
Seth: ... and for their failure to live up to God's own covenant commands to bless the world.
David: Yeah.
Seth: Right? Like, that was, like, the original purpose of Israel.
David: Right.
Seth: By their following of God, they would bless the nations. Jonah did not do that as a representative of Israel.
David: Yeah.
Seth: And Israel, while they c- ma- ma- maintain, remained in exile, failed to do it as well.
David: Yeah.
Seth: So they read on the Day of Atonement to mourn, lament, and repent of their failure as God's people.
David: Yeah. It's really interesting to then think about reading Jonah on the Day of Atonement as a Christian because-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... our Day of Atonement is the day Jesus died on the cross.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Like, that's the day that the final sacrificial lamb was slain.
Seth: I'm just imagining some church trying [laughs] to preach Jonah-
David: [laughs]
Seth: ... on Easter Sunday. [laughs]
David: That would be, that would be a difficult task.
Seth: I, I, kind of it makes me really excited. Like, if I were to plant a church, we're starting on Easter Sunday, and it's the Book of Jonah. [laughs]
David: The Book of Jonah. [laughs] It's like, "Wait, what are you doing?" And, but it's like, um, how is, how, how are the nations blessed? By the covenant of, of God, by God's sa- sa- salvation. Like-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... how could the wicked, cut off nations be blessed? Like, we, we talked about how evil and violent the Assyrians were.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Like, i- is, is God evil for blessing them?
Seth: Right. Is he... So Jonah is on the top of the mountain-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... remember? And he calls God evil for extending mercy to the Ninevites.
David: Right. And it's like, well, he would've been, just like he would've been evil to pass over the sins of his own people, Israel-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... had it not been for the Day of Atonement-
Seth: Mm
David: ... that sins were righted, that wrongs were put back, that justice was done. And on our day of atonement-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... Jesus died on the cross for our sins, for the sins of the whole world-
Seth: Wow
David: ... for the sins of the nations-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... so that God would be proven as not evil to save-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... the nations-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... but good as just and justifier-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... uh, 'cause Jesus died-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... like, on our new day of atonement. It's interesting.
Seth: So, no, it's-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... good news.
David: It's very good news.
Seth: I mean, like, yeah, like Jesus, if Jesus is the fulfillment of the Day of Atonement-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... and the Book of Jonah acts as a way for us to repeat our own failures to be God's chosen people-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... there is forgiveness for us in Jesus when we fail to live up to his covenant commands.
David: Yeah.
Seth: It's, it's-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... it's good news.
David: Okay. So that was the first one.
Seth: That was the first one.
David: What's the second one?
Seth: Well, the second one continues to l- basically, it'll lead into the same idea.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: But, um, Jonah, when he's on top of the mountain and he sees the mercy God extends to Nineveh, he calls it evil.
David: Right.
Seth: He calls it exceedingly evil that he would, God would extend mercy to Israel's enemies while allowing Israel to remain in exile.
David: Right.
Seth: That's, because that's-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... a breaking of the promise to Jonah, right?
David: Right.
Seth: It's like-
David: That he's like, "We were your chosen people. Like, how are you gonna go back on your covenant and show, like, forgiveness to these heathens?"
Seth: Right. And remember, Nineveh was a superpower at the time.
David: Right.
Seth: So showing mercy to Nineveh kinda was a death sentence to Israel-
David: Right
Seth: ... and eventually, it would be.
David: It was, yes.
Seth: It was a death sentence to Israel. So Jonah's like-On to some of the tension
David: Not asking a completely unfounded question.
Seth: Right. It's like, what... Like, how can God's mercy towards the oppressor be reconciled with God's commitment to the oppressed-
David: Right
Seth: ... on the most general level?
David: Yes.
Seth: But then what about God's chosen people versus the nations He has not chosen?
David: Right. And so Jonah, as representative of Israel, looking down at their future captors and oppressors and exilers, refuses to give, like, the repentance that God wants to give to them.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: He refuses to forgive them. He refuses to-
Seth: Extend mercy
David: ... want... Like, extend mercy, yeah, to them.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Instead, he just sits there in judgment over them.
Seth: Yes.
David: Yeah.
Seth: But remember what Jesus talks about, it being the sign of Jonah.
David: Uh-huh.
Seth: And I just kept... So, like, so if Jonah is representative of Israel-
David: Yes
Seth: ... in one sense, Jesus is the-
David: Is the ultimate
Seth: ... ultimate representation-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... of Israel, exiled by the powers. Like, right?
David: Right. Yes, yes, yes.
Seth: He's in exile as a Jewish citizen under Roman oppression.
David: Uh-huh. Even exiled, in a sense, as a Galilean.
Seth: Yes.
David: You know, not... He's not a, he's not a Judean.
Seth: Right.
David: He doesn't live in Jerusalem.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: He's a, "Ugh, you're a Galilean."
Seth: Yep.
David: Yep.
Seth: And eventually, he will die, and there's enough Biblical evidence to talk to his, about his death as a type of exile-
David: Right
Seth: ... just like Israel died.
David: And he died, he did not die in the city, you know-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... in this, like, very Jewish way. He was, like, and it says, "Cursed is..." Like, the Deuteronomy says, "Cursed is anyone who hangs on a tree." So not only was he crucified outside the city walls-
Seth: Right
David: ... exiled from Jerusalem, he died as a, as a cut-off one-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... on the, on the tree.
Seth: And if Jonah is somewhat right to be offended that God would show mercy to the oppressors when they, God's own people were being judged-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... how much more of a scandal is it for God to refuse to extend mercy to His own Son-
David: Right
Seth: ... as He's murdered and crucified on the cross, while His oppressors on the cross, Jesus says, are forgiven.
David: Right.
Seth: Jesus p-
David: Yeah.
Seth: Like, no-
David: I mean, He's sitting there, like, the embodiment of being a forsaken Israelite.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"
Seth: Right.
David: I mean, you could almost, you could almost hear Jonah praying that prayer-
Seth: Yes
David: ... on the mountain overlooking Nineveh.
Seth: Yes.
David: "God, why are you forsaking me and going after Nineveh?"
Seth: Yeah.
David: "Like, why would you do that?"
Seth: Why'd you avoid my prayer? Why are you forsaking me, God?
David: Yeah.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Where did my plague go? You're forsaking me. Yeah. But Jesus was actually cut off from, like, from God.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Actually exiled, and yet in that moment, did not do what Jonah did.
Seth: Jonah called that type of mercy evil.
David: Evil.
Seth: But Jesus... And, and what, what did Moses refuse to do? He refused to extend-
David: Jonah.
Seth: Jonah. What did... Jonah refused to, he refused to extend mercy to Nineveh.
David: Right.
Seth: But Jesus on the cross says, "Father, forgive them."
David: Right.
Seth: He forgives the same people-
David: Yes
Seth: ... Jonah refuses to. And remember what Jonah says at the ver- what God says at the very end of the book-
David: Mm
Seth: ... of Jonah about Nineveh? They don't know their right hand from their left hand.
David: Yes. This is our third big realization that we made.
Seth: It-
David: So-
Seth: Which just means they don't know what they're doing
David: They don't... To, to not know your right from your left is an Old Testament way to talk about ignorance. Like, you just, you don't know good and evil.
Seth: You don't know the right way to live.
David: Right.
Seth: You don't know God's way to live.
David: You don't, you're not wise. You just don't, you, you don't know what you're doing. And so Jesus s- like, he-
Seth: While he's reversing-
David: Yes
Seth: ... what Jonah does, says, "Father, forgive them," because?
David: Yeah, they don't know their right hand from their left. They don't know what they're doing.
Seth: They don't know what they're doing.
David: And so Jesus is pulling on the story of Jonah.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: And like, I mean, if you haven't seen that yet, I mean, he's this exiled-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... uh, you know, prophet, gone to the nations, you know, all this stuff. I mean, th- they cast lots on the boat, in Jonah's boat.
Seth: Right.
David: Right? They, like, they cast lots for Jesus's clothing. Like, the story of Jonah is really repeating itself, and then for him to say the words of God very closely here-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... where he's like, "Shouldn't I save Nineveh? 'Cause they don't, they're, they don't know what they're doing. They, they don't know their right hand from their left." Jesus forgives them because they don't know their right h- hand from their left. And-
Seth: He does exactly the opposite of what Jonah did.
David: Yes. And it's like there's this profound mercy and almost, like, sympathy in that statement. Like-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... he's not saying, like, "God, forgive them because they're a bunch of simpletons."
Seth: Yeah.
David: "God, forgive them 'cause they're, they're just idiots." No, that's not what's happening here. He's like, Nineveh hadn't been trained in the way of the Lord, you know? Like-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... the people who crucified them did not know they were crucifying the Lord of Glory, Acts says.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: Right?
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: Like, they, they didn't know. A- and so, like, they just did not know what they were doing, and there's this sympathy that, like... I, I'm reminded of the psalm that says, like, He knows that we are mortal, that we are but flesh.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Like, He knows that we are like grass that withers. Like, there's this sympathy-
Seth: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm
David: ... that almighty God shows to human beings, that like, man, sometimes we just don't know what we're doing. There's this sympathy-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... that Jesus showed to his persecutors that Jonah refused to show to the Ninevites.
Seth: That's right.
David: Yeah.
Seth: And Jonah also wanted, would rather have died-
David: Yes
Seth: ... than see God's mercy extended to his enemies.
David: Right.
Seth: But Jesus willingly dies-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... to extend mercy to His enemies.
David: Right.
Seth: Jesus willingly does what Jonah wanted to use as an escape.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Jonah, Jesus wanted to enter into death to save His enemies. Jesus, Jonah wanted to escape to death to not see God's mercy.
David: Right.
Seth: Jesus is the better Jonah.
David: Yes. [laughs] He is.
Seth: He's the better Jonah.
David: Jesus is the much better Jonah. Yeah, that's so good.
Seth: Um-
David: So that was what was on our minds.
Seth: That was what it was on our minds.
David: [laughs]
Seth: And we were like, "We have to put this on the podcast."
David: Run back in the podcast studio-
Seth: Um
David: ... and record this. Yeah.
Seth: So again, guys, thank you so much for listening for so long. Half a million downloads, it feels like a huge, humbling, um, uh, milestone-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... for us behind the scenes. Thank you for listening.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Thank you for being a part of this community. We're happy to do what we do. Um-
David: Yeah. So yeah, that's, now, now that is officially the book of Jonah.
Seth: That is officially-
David: Now, now we've-
David: ... we've, we've now signed off on this. So yeah.
Seth: Uh-huh.
David: Thank you all for listening, like Seth said, and, uh, we'll see you next week. [outro music]
Outro: Thank you for listening to the Spoken Gospel podcast. Spoken Gospel creates short films, devotionals, and podcasts like this one. Everything we make is free because of generous supporters like you. To see our resources, visit spokengospel.com or subscribe to our YouTube channel. Thanks for listening. See you next week. [outro music]