Intro: [gentle music] Welcome to the Spoken Gospel podcast. This is our attempt to speak the gospel out of every corner of scripture. We believe every part of the Bible, Old Testament and New, is about Jesus, and this podcast is our experiment to publicly test that belief. Let's jump in. [upbeat music]
David: Okay, well, this is the last episode in the Book of Genesis.
Seth: Yes.
David: We're gonna, we're gonna talk about the last main character, Joseph.
Seth: Yes.
David: Yeah. How you feeling today, Seth?
Seth: Well, old.
David: Old. Why?
Seth: I am officially you can throw your back out years old.
David: Oh, did you throw your back out today?
Seth: I did. [laughs]
David: Oh, no.
Seth: Three days ago. [laughs]
David: I didn't know that.
Seth: I've been, like, lying on the ground and putting my feet up at 90-degree angles because-
David: Oh
Seth: ... I can't walk around, so that... If you're wondering, guys, 30 years old.
David: That's the-
Seth: That's-
David: I think the first time I threw my back out was at 30.
Seth: Same.
David: Yeah.
Seth: Our bo- our bodies are officially decomposing.
David: It's true. Death is coming.
Seth: Yeah.
David: But we triumph over it because the serpent's head has been crushed.
Seth: Well-
David: [laughs]
Seth: Wow. Is this a good, is this a good segue?
David: Jesus Juke right out the box.
Seth: Jesus Juke. [laughs]
David: I really wanna, like, I thought about changing the name of this podcast to-
Seth: To Jesus Jukes? [laughs]
David: ... Jesus Jukes. [laughs]
Seth: Jesus Jukes.
David: Jesus Jukes with Seth and David. [laughs]
Seth: [laughs]
David: But, um, anyway, we're not doing that.
Seth: All youth pastors everywhere, tune in.
David: That's right. That's right. How do I Jesus Juke?
Seth: Jesus is the true and better Harambe. [laughs]
David: Jesus is the true and better throw it and your back out.
Seth: [laughs]
David: Anyway, so we've talked about, um, Eve and the fall and the flood, and then we went, went... Our th- our four main characters.
Seth: Abraham.
David: Abraham.
Seth: Isaac.
David: Isaac.
Seth: Jacob.
David: Jacob. And now-
Seth: Now.
David: ... Joseph.
Seth: Joseph.
David: Right. So these are, these are the patriarchs, right?
Seth: Yeah, yeah.
David: Is that right?
Seth: The patriarchs.
David: Okay, the patriarchs. Fantastic. And so if you'll remember, Jacob had 12 sons through some really, um, [laughs] I don't know, what do you call it, like, Family Feud-
Seth: Yes
David: ... stuff going on.
Seth: A baby-making competition.
David: Baby-making competition, yeah. I like that. And Joseph is kinda the last but not least-
Seth: Yes
David: ... of, of the, of... And he-
Seth: He is the... Judah's, one of Judah's favorite sons.
David: Ju- J- J- Jacob's.
Seth: Jacob's.
David: That's so, so many J names.
Seth: There's so-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... one of Jacob's favorite sons-
David: Right
Seth: ... because he's the son-
David: Well, any, yeah
Seth: ... of his favorite wife
David: ... of Rachel.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Right, yeah. Yeah. Finally, my hot wife had a ki- [laughs]
Seth: Is that, is that-
David: I mean, you know.
Seth: And then-
David: He's a patriarch, what are you gonna do?
Seth: ... he gets-
David: Patriarchal society. [laughs]
Seth: A... [laughs]
David: I can't even follow. [laughs]
Seth: [laughs] Li- of, uh... David told me that he had some inner ear problems before we went on air.
David: I do. My, my, my left ear-
Seth: And so I think-
David: ... is completely clogged
Seth: ... all of this episode is just gonna be [laughs] choked up to-
David: Okay. I-
Seth: ... David's ear problem
David: ... it's fine. I like that. I'm also on Benadryl.
Seth: Oh, yeah.
David: Cutting it with coffee.
Seth: Mm.
David: So it's working real well for me. Um-
Seth: Welcome.
David: Welcome.
Seth: To the trip.
David: To, to the trip.
Seth: [laughs]
David: Uh, so anyway, so we, we, we, we kinda get a glimpse into this family and, yeah, we find out that Jaco- or Joseph is the favorite of Jacob, and i- it is designated by the fact that he makes him this famous coat.
Seth: Coat. Technicolor dreamcoat.
David: Technicolor dreamcoat, that's right. He makes him this coat of many colors and puts it on him, and it is this visible symbol that Joseph's the favorite.
Seth: Right.
David: Uh, and again, we have this thing repeated that the younger son seems to have the favor.
Seth: Right.
David: Right?
Seth: Yes.
David: That, uh, like, like we had Abel over Cain, we had Jacob over Esau, and-
Seth: Well, the difference here-
David: Yep
Seth: ... is that Joseph, even though he's the favored by Jacob-
David: By Jacob. Uh-huh
Seth: ... by Jacob, is not the promised seed.
David: That's right.
Seth: So even though he's the promised se- even though he's not the promised seed, he's still the, uh, the favored one.
David: Ooh, which is interesting because Jacob's dad, Isaac, did kinda the same thing. God had chosen Jacob, but Isaac favored Esau.
Seth: Yes.
David: And so he's kind of repeating the sins of his father.
Seth: Family history.
David: Family history.
Seth: [laughs]
David: Yeah, is like, y- you know, we, what we'll find out is that despite what we're about to read next, Judah is actually the one who gets in the line of Jesus, the promised seed.
Seth: Yes.
David: But, uh-
Seth: Joseph essentially-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... makes sure it happens.
David: Oh, yeah.
Seth: Joseph is the one, without Joseph's faithfulness-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... and agency, um, and faithfulness to God-
David: Right
Seth: ... Judah would never have survived.
David: Right, 'cause they would've died in the upcoming famine.
Seth: And I think that's-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... one of the unique things about Joseph's story is up to this point, Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, when we see them, we kind of know they're morally compromised characters.
David: Right.
Seth: We look at them and we see these guys have pretty clear character flaws.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: But despite human faithlessness, God has proven over and over again that he is faithful.
David: Right.
Seth: And in Joseph, we get a picture of what faithfulness actually looks like. And even, and so, like, there's very, like, Joseph is never painted in a poor light. Joseph's actions are considered good and holy-
David: Mm
Seth: ... and wise throughout the entire narrative, and w- his faithfulness is what allows, uh, Judah's line to continue.
David: Mm.
Seth: He's responding faithfully to God's faithfulness to him.
David: Right.
Seth: And so that's the unique thing about Joseph and the thing that we are supposed to take away as well. Like, we are supposed to see Joseph in some senses in, as an exemplar for ourselves as well. Like, here's a man who's faithful to God's covenant-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... in response.
David: But isn't it interesting that, like, um, we, if you're reading this straight through and you're, you're thinking about Genesis 3:15, you're waiting for this promised seed to come, and you read through the whole story of Joseph, you're like, "This guy is different. Like, he is a moral exemplar."
Seth: Yeah.
David: "He's really good. He hasn't messed up yet." And in fact, in the story that we're looking at now in, in chapter 37, there's these dreams and visions given to him where people are bowing down to him, and he is reigning over all of them. Even his parents are bowing to him, and it's like, this must be the promised seed. Um, but, like, you get, we g- we'll get to the end of Genesis and-He's not.
Seth: He's not.
David: A- and what, what's striking is these, there's these two stories put side by side. So let's kinda look at them side by side, 'cause I think that might be helpful. So first you have the really famous story of Joseph getting his, his coat of many colors.
Seth: Right.
David: His brothers get jealous because he's ge- being favored by his dad, and he's having these dreams and saying like, "Hey, I had this dream from God and you all bowed down to me," and they get mad.
Seth: Not, not the best little brother move. [laughs]
David: Not the best little brother move. But, you know, uh, and like, and people talk about, like, that was a sin.
Seth: Okay. Yeah.
David: Like, I've heard, I've had people talk about like that's a sin. I think he's just, if he is like the younger brother-
Seth: He is
David: ... and, and I think he's more naive than anything, where he just like, imagine having this vision from God.
Seth: Yeah.
David: And like what are you gonna do? You're gonna go-
Seth: You're already the favorite.
David: Yeah. [laughs]
Seth: [laughs]
David: Yeah. I mean, favoritism breeds naivety, right?
Seth: [laughs]
David: I think that's very true. A- a- but, but you would come to your family and be like, "Guys, I just had a vision from God. Like, l- listen to what happened. Okay, here's what I saw," and he tells them the vision.
Seth: Right.
David: He's not thinking like, you know, "Yeah, take that losers. I'm so much better than you."
Seth: Right.
David: I don't think we see him doing that. Okay, so we have this, and the, the brothers get jealous. They, they take, they, they take him out into, like, this, this far place where his-
Seth: What were the two stories side by side?
David: Uh, we- oh, Judah-
Seth: Oh
David: ... and Tamar.
Seth: Oh. Oh, oh, oh, oh.
David: I wanna, I wanna do these side by... 'Cause we're talking about which one's the chosen seed.
Seth: Right.
David: So I think it's really interesting. So that's the other one we're gonna get to. But we have this famous one. His brothers take him out, they fake his death, they sell him into slavery, they bring his, his, his coat back covered in animal blood and tell a lie to their dad that he was mauled by a wild animal.
Seth: Right.
David: And Jacob weeps. And then we get this next story of Judah and Tamar.
Seth: So Judah's supposed to be-
David: [laughs]
Seth: And we already expect Judah to be the promised seed.
David: Oh, right, because the other two have disqualified themselves-
Seth: Right
David: ... in the defiling of Dinah.
Seth: Right.
David: Which we talked about last week.
Seth: Yes.
David: Okay. Yes. Okay.
Seth: So this is supposed to be the promised seed, and Judah is failing to live up to his covenant obligations to provide a seed. He's not increasing and multiplying and going on and doing what God has commanded the promised seed to do. And the, the, uh, s- that's [laughs] the basic version of the story, but it gets complicated because-
David: He's doing it, he's... This is the nicest whitewashed way-
Seth: [laughs]
David: ... to say this. [laughs]
Seth: But so there i- so-
David: First off, he doesn't marry the right kind of woman.
Seth: No.
David: He marries a Canaanite woman, right?
Seth: Yes.
David: So everyone else has gone back to the land of Abraham to marry a wife, right? Isaac did it with Rebecca, Jacob did it with Rachel, and now, uh, y- this Judah, who is supposed to be, well, hopefully he'll be the oldest son who can actually be a faithful dude-
Seth: Yes
David: ... he goes and marries a Canaanite woman, which you're not supposed to do.
Seth: Right.
David: And he has two sons from them. The first one, um, is, is, is, is married to a woman named Tamar, which we'll revisit later.
Seth: Yes.
David: And but both of these sons are so evil that God just kills them.
Seth: Yes. [laughs]
David: Like-
Seth: Immediately
David: ... whoa. [laughs] Like, that's how bad they are. And so we're seeing, like, man, Judah is not the best dad. He's not the best carrier of this promise. He is marrying the wrong tribe and having such-
Seth: Yes
David: ... evil children that God has to put them to death.
Seth: Yes.
David: Okay. So what happens is J- J- uh, Judah's oldest son marries this woman named Tamar, which I've talked about, and he says, "Okay, here's what you need to do, Tamar, 'cause you don't have a husband anymore. Just wait until my y- my new young son-
Seth: Right
David: ... my third son grows up, then you can marry him [laughs].
Seth: Yes.
David: And, and he can give you children.
Seth: So this i- this is called the law of the Levirate marriage.
David: That's right.
Seth: And the idea is the, this, the family line needs to be passed on.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: The legacy of the brother needs to be passed on. We can't let the family be forgotten.
David: Right.
Seth: And so the brother of the deceased husband takes his place and [laughs] marries this woman.
David: Marries this... Yeah. Yeah.
Seth: And the first child is considered an heir to the brother.
David: That's right.
Seth: And so this way, God's family line will live on.
David: That's right.
Seth: Uh, yeah, so Judah-
David: Right
Seth: ... refuses to do his duty as a father and make sure that his son marries his widowed daughter-in-law.
David: 'Cause he has a third son.
Seth: Sh- uh, his name is-
David: Shelah
Seth: ... Shelah.
David: Right.
Seth: And he says, "Okay, Tamar, go back home to your father."
David: Uh-huh.
Seth: "Wait until my son is grown up and I will send him to you. You'll be re- you'll be remarried-
David: Uh-huh
Seth: ... and the family line will continue."
David: I'll... Yeah, which is the right thing to do.
Seth: Which is the right thing to do.
David: Okay. But ti- we get this little line that says-
Seth: In, in the course of time
David: ... in the course of time. Time passes.
Seth: And then we are also told in a couple verses down in verse 14-
David: Uh-huh
Seth: ... "When Tamna saw that Shelah had grown up and she had not, and he had not been given to him-"
David: Oh, uh-oh.
Seth: She's like, "Okay, so Judah is failing his obligation-
David: That's right
Seth: ... to provide me with the, the heir that I was promised-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... my original husband's heir."
David: Right.
Seth: And so-
David: So not only are Judah's two first sons so bad that God killed them, now Judah is, is, like, withholding his third son in a sinful way as well.
Seth: Yeah. So he-
David: This is all messed up.
Seth: Right. And I think I said already before, like, he's literally not fulfilling the command of Genesis 1 to be fruitful-
David: Oh
Seth: ... and multiply.
David: Yeah, right.
Seth: So Tamar takes matters into her own hands.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Uh, she dresses like a prostitute, [laughs] sleeps with Judah, gets pregnant by Judah, and has his son.
David: Right.
Seth: Judah hears about that this daughter-in-law is getting, is pregnant-
David: Right
Seth: ... and wants to kill her for it. And she says, "No, you can't because it's your son," and proves it-
David: Right
Seth: ... to her with the, with these artifacts that she has.
David: Yeah, she, Tamar's about to be burned at the stake, and is like, a- and then proves, like, has, like, this court of law at her execution [laughs] and is like-
Seth: Yes
David: ... "Here are the things that you gave me as the cult prostitute, as my price, and these belong to you."
Seth: Right.
David: "I can prove to you that you're the dad."
Seth: Yes.
David: And then-
Seth: And then he says, "Yes, yes."
David: Yep.
Seth: "The, that's me."
David: "That's me."
Seth: "That's me, guys."
David: "Can't escape that one." [laughs]
Seth: And then he says, "She is more righteous than I-
David: Mm
Seth: ... since I did not give to her my son Shelah."
David: Yeah.
David: And why, so why is she more righteous? I think it's because, uh, she was faithful to carry on the line.
Seth: Right.
David: Like she knew that this line had to be preserved and carry on. She knew that there were these echoes of Genesis 3:15 in her head that this is God's chosen line, you know, th- you know, my, my, my, my ex-husband's great-great-grandfather is Abraham. All this stuff is happening. I've got to get pregnant-
Seth: [laughs] Right
David: ... with someone from Judah.
Seth: Yes.
David: I have to. And so she was righteous because she's fulfilling-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... God's plan-
Seth: Yeah, she is
David: ... to bring about a seed.
Seth: Yeah, she's actually trusting-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... that God will provide a seed that will bless the nations of the world in a way that Judah is not.
David: Right. We can talk about, like-
Seth: The ethics of this [laughs]
David: ... the ethics of this are not-
Seth: Ideal [laughs]
David: [laughs] No, are not It's very hard to get through the ethics of this.
Seth: But the point is, what man has intended for evil-
David: Yes
Seth: ... God continues to intend for good.
David: That is the point.
Seth: And we also have, there is, we see this line continue. Her, she has twins-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... just like Esau and Jacob-
David: Yep
Seth: ... were twins. They wrestle in the womb, just like-
David: Just like them
Seth: ... just like Ju- Jacob and Esau wrestled in the womb. And then we also, their names are picked up in the Book of Ruth as well-
David: Mm
Seth: ... when Ruth becomes this figure of Tamar, this righteous woman of Tamar, and both of them end up b- being included in Jesus' genealogy.
David: Right. That's what's so crazy about this whole thing, is you would think that if you were reading the Book of Genesis and anyone was gonna be in the line of the promised seed, it would end up being Joseph, this moral exemplar-
Seth: Right
David: ... this favored son, this one to whom he's having, for whom he's having visions.
Seth: The one who is actually being faithful.
David: He's being faithful. Like, we're gonna see him rise to prominence here in just a second. And like, w- so like, what, when we read Matthew or Luke, I can't remember.
Seth: Matthew.
David: Matthew. Whe- when we, when we read Matthew's opening genealogy and we see Perez and we see Tamar, and like, uh, what should we be thinking? Like, what is God trying to communicate to us in putting these morally compromised characters in his son's genealogy?
Seth: Right.
David: What is he trying to communicate to us?
Seth: I think what he's trying to communicate is two things simultaneously.
David: Okay.
Seth: What human beings intend for evil-
David: Right
Seth: ... God intends for good.
David: Definitely.
Seth: We've talked about that over and over again.
David: Yep, yep.
Seth: But the other thing he's showing us is that even h- like, human faithfulness, it's not, it's not about J- Joseph isn't saved because he's morally faithful.
David: Mm.
Seth: He's saved because God has purposes to save Israel.
David: Yeah.
Seth: The reason why Israel ends up ultimately succeeding is not because of Joseph's faithfulness, but it's because of God's.
David: Right.
Seth: We're not saved, in the words of Paul, by works of law-
David: Yep
Seth: ... but by trust in Jesus alone.
David: Mm.
Seth: And so I think even here we have God's faithfulness despite human faithlessness.
David: Yeah.
Seth: And even human faithfulness, as good and exemplary as it is and how we should follow Joseph-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... that is actually not what, that's not ultimately what brings God's purposes a- about.
David: Right.
Seth: It's God's plan, God's will, God's, uh, determination, and his grace towards people who don't deserve it. [gentle music]
David: Okay, so now we come upon the story in Genesis 39 that is preached in every Worth the Wait classroom that I've ever been in, every-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... every sexual seminar for middle schoolers.
Seth: This is this one.
David: This is, it's this one.
Seth: This is, it's this.
David: It's, it's Joseph is working in this Egyptian official's house, Potiphar, and, uh-
Seth: Who has this beautiful wife-
David: Beautiful wife
Seth: ... who just keeps coming onto him
David: ... who just keeps wanting, wanting Joseph. And he keeps saying no, and eventually she even tries to, like, corner him.
Seth: Yeah.
David: And he flees, uh-
Seth: Right
David: ... like, naked, right?
Seth: Yeah, she's-
David: She, like, grabs his garment
Seth: ... yeah, she's, like, grabbing his clothes off of him-
David: Yeah [laughs]
Seth: ... and he's running out of the house-
David: Right
Seth: ... trying to get away from her.
David: And so, like, I always remember, like, th- [laughs] this story in school, or not school, at church and stuff, where it was like, man, like, it doesn't matter how f- clo- like, close you are to doing some kinda sexual sin-
Seth: Just run
David: ... like, you can still run away-
Seth: [laughs]
David: ... was always the point. [laughs]
Seth: Your clothes could be off.
David: Your clothes could-
Seth: Under the covers.
David: I've literally heard this.
Seth: And then just run out of the house.
David: Yes.
Seth: [laughs]
David: I've literally heard that message.
David: So is that what we are supposed to be learning from, uh, from the story of Joseph, Seth?
Seth: Uh, [laughs] I think it's a point you could make [laughs] about the story of Joseph.
David: Okay. Okay.
Seth: Like, I think Joseph, as we've said over and over again-
David: Is
Seth: ... is an example of human-
David: Yep
Seth: ... faithfulness-
David: Right
Seth: ... in response to God's faithfulness.
David: Right.
Seth: And I think in a lot of ways we're supposed to look to him and say, "Yes, he is-"
David: That was real good.
Seth: "That was a real good move."
David: Yep.
Seth: Unlike, unlike Judah-
David: Yes
Seth: ... the promised seed whose sexual brokenness is on full display-
David: That's right
Seth: ... Joseph is a sexually-
David: Sexually faithful
Seth: ... pure and sexually-
David: Pure, yep
Seth: ... faithful man. So it is interesting that Judah and Tamar is put up right against the story-
David: It's right against it
Seth: ... the Potiphar story.
David: Yes.
Seth: You're supposed to see that God is using faithful Joseph-
David: Yep
Seth: ... to bring unfaithful Judah, the pr-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... to be, to be the promised one. Doesn't it-
David: Isn't, yeah, yeah, that definitely makes sense. But isn't it, it's also really interesting that God can use for good sexual chastity and sexual brokenness.
Seth: Right.
David: I think that's just really interesting. I think that's really good news for people who are like, like, "I, my sexuality is so compromised. I've done such-
Seth: Right
David: ... terrible things with it-
Seth: Right
David: ... that there's no way God could use my story and my life and what's, or my children or my, my marriage-
Seth: Yes
David: ... or whatever for good." And it's like-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... this is showing the exact opposite of that.
Seth: Yeah.
David: So I just think that's really good.
Seth: And think about it this way, too. You have, Joseph isn't just a moral exemplar. He points us to Jesus.
David: That's right.
Seth: Jesus was a single man-
David: Yep
Seth: ... like Joseph, I think at this point in the story.
David: Yep.
Seth: He was sexually faithful-
David: Yep
Seth: ... and sexually pure, and it's through his faithfulness that sexually broken people are still en- enter into-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... his family line.
David: That's right.
Seth: So why does unfaithful Judah get into the family line? Because faithful Joseph is faithful.
David: Right [laughs] Yeah.
Seth: And so Jesus does the same thing. He is faithful sexually when we are not.
David: Yep.
Seth: And he invites all sexually broken people into his family line if we would just trust in him-
David: Right
Seth: ... if we would trust in his faithfulness.
David: Yeah.
Seth: I think-
Seth: I think part of the problem with say, casting this only as a moral story of don't do this-
David: Uh-huh
Seth: ... it ends up just being an exercise in shame.
David: That's right.
Seth: Uh, I'm sure ev- a lot of our listeners have heard like the example of the rose.
David: Oh. Yeah.
Seth: It's like some guy gets up on stage, and he says, "Isn't, isn't this rose beautiful?"
David: Yeah.
Seth: "Isn't this rose so, so, so beautiful? Like, here, I want everyone to experience it." And they, they pass it around the room, and by the time it gets back to the stage, it's just falling apart-
David: Right
Seth: ... because it's passed through, you know, 100 middle schoolers' hands.
David: Yeah.
Seth: And then he just says, "Who would want this?"
David: Mm.
Seth: Who would want this?
David: This broken-
Seth: Broken thing. I mean, you feel that at the end of Judah and Tamar. Who would want this?
David: Right.
Seth: Who would want this? And Matt Chandler's line is just like, "Jesus does."
David: Jesus wants the... [laughs]
Seth: Jesus wants the rose.
David: Yeah.
Seth: He wants you, and He is faithful to the end to give it to you.
David: That's really good. Yeah. Okay, so what's interesting then is at the end of the net result, I should say, the net result of Joseph's faithful sexuality is-
Seth: He's thrown into a pit
David: ... is he's thrown into prison.
Seth: Another pit.
David: Another pit, yeah.
Seth: [laughs]
David: His brothers threw him into one pit whenever, like, whenever like, "We're gonna hold you here until we figure out what to do with you." Now, he's thrown into another pit in the, in the belly of Egypt.
Seth: Yeah.
David: And, um, that, I just find that really interesting too. And maybe it goes back a little bit to what you were talking about with, um, we're not... I, I don't think this is the point the text is making, but I can't help but think about it, where it's like we're not saved by our own-
Seth: Right
David: ... righteousness-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... our own faithfulness. And it's like Joseph's faithfulness was not rewarded here immediately.
Seth: Right.
David: And, um, and it, and yet it seems like Judah's unfaithfulness was rewarded with twins.
Seth: Yeah.
David: And so it's just everything's upside down i- in this. It's really... It's... And I think it's supposed to throw you off.
Seth: Right, and show you again how faithful Joseph is. Even in the pit-
David: Right
Seth: ... God is blessing him.
David: Yes.
Seth: God is elevating him to positions of authority.
David: Yep.
Seth: And he, while he's in there, he meets these, a baker and a cupbearer.
David: Yep.
Seth: Interprets dreams for them, they end up getting, one gets executed, another one gets elevated back to power. And-
David: The time comes when Pharaoh has a dream that he needs interpreted-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... and guess who they call upon? Joseph down in the pit.
Seth: That's right.
David: Yep.
Seth: The cupbearer says, "There's a man in the pit who can interpret your dreams," and he is elevated again-
David: Yep
Seth: ... through power. [laughs] So-
David: That's right. So no matter, no matter what Joseph has to go through, no matter what suffering or trials, God is continuously faithful to bring him out of it, and not only out of it back to where he was, but to elevate him to a higher position of authority and power.
Seth: Yes.
David: Right? And I, I mean, you, you just, you can't help but see the gospel in that. Like, that Jesus, who was robed not in a technical or dream coat, but with all splendor and glory, right, walked through the same kind of derision that Joseph's brothers put Joseph through, right? They, you know, they, they, they beat him. They sold him for money into slavery like, like, like, um, oh, what's his name? The betrayer. [laughs] Oh, my goodness.
Seth: Judas. [laughs]
David: Judas. There should be J names right now.
Seth: [laughs]
David: Judas betrayed Jesus and sold him into slavery. Um, Jesus was, you know, put down into a pit, not just jail, but literally into a grave after he died, and he rose again to power, not at the right hand of Pharaoh, which we'll soon see, but at the right hand of God, who's above all kingdoms, all power, all authority. As it's like Joseph is walking us through, like, what it looks like for the morally faithful one of God to be able to be risen to a high place of power despite the depths of suffering to which he has to go.
Seth: Yes.
David: So I, I think we see that here in the Joseph story, so I think that's pretty cool. So Joseph is, um, interprets correctly Pharaoh's dream.
Seth: So Pharaoh has two dreams.
David: Yep.
Seth: They're parallel dreams, and we're-
David: Right
Seth: ... the reason we're told he has two dreams, because in the doubling of Pharaoh's dream means that the thing is fixed by God, and God will shortly bring it about.
David: Oh, right.
Seth: And that should trigger things for you because Joseph had two dreams as well.
David: Oh, right.
Seth: And so why? Because this thing is set in God's mind-
David: Oh
Seth: ... that he will rule over his brothers, and he will shortly bring it about.
David: Yep.
Seth: And he interprets the dreams correctly. And we're told that essentially he, it is seen as a, as, as wisdom.
David: Right.
Seth: And I think this is something that John Sailhamer points out. When you read the two stories of the two guys in the pit with him, they're very similar dreams, and you really wouldn't be able to tell which one was good and which one was bad-
David: Mm
Seth: ... just by looking at it.
David: Right.
Seth: The only way which you would is by exercising this godly type of wisdom where you're communicating with the Lord, asking him what it means, and telling him the vision, telling him the meaning. The same thing's happening here. Joseph is exercising wisdom because he's being compared to the wise men over and over again. So Joseph is exercising this degree of-
David: Oh, the wise men in Pharaoh's-
Seth: In Pharaoh's court
David: ... court.
Seth: The magicians and-
David: Who couldn't inter-
Seth: Who couldn't
David: ... interpret the dream. Okay. That, okay.
Seth: So there's a wis- I think part of what we're supposed to see here is not Jesus, uh, J- Jesus, Joseph-
David: Yep
Seth: ... isn't just, um, faithful.
David: Right.
Seth: He's also wise.
David: Mm, he's wise and faithful.
Seth: He's wise and faithful.
David: Yeah.
Seth: He's this wise leader who can interpret correctly-
David: Right
Seth: ... the visions that people have, uh, from the Lord.
David: Okay.
Seth: And so, uh, Daniel will pick up on this, and when Nebuchadnezzar has a dream-
David: Yep
Seth: ... Daniel, there's a lot of allusions to the Joseph story in the-
David: Oh
Seth: ... book of Daniel.
David: Okay. Yeah.
Seth: And then Paul in 1 Corinthians picks up on this as well.
David: Does he?
Seth: He does.
David: Okay.
Seth: Yeah.
David: I wanna, I wanna hear this. I don't know where you're going.
Seth: So, uh, 1 Corinthians 2:6. Remember, Joseph is being compared to the rulers of the, his age. Daniel is being compared to the rulers and the enchanters of Nebuchadnezzar's day.
David: Okay. Right.
Seth: And in 1 Corinthians 2 it says, "Yet among the church we do impart wisdom, although it is not a wisdom of this age or of the rulers of this age who are doomed to pass away. But we impart a secret and a hidden wisdom of God which God decreed before the ages for our glory. None of the rulers of this age understood this, for if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of g- glory."
David: Mm.
Seth: And yeah, "For the Spirit searches everything, even the depths of God. For who knows a person's thoughts except the spirit of that person, which is in him? So also no one comprehends the thoughts of God except the Spirit of God."
David: Okay.
Seth: So we're... And so w- we're, so Paul is meditating on the stories of Joseph-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... and the stories of Daniel, and what are we told about Joseph, uh, in chapter 41? That the s- the, the Pharaoh, 42, he says, "Clearly you have the spirit of God."
David: Oh, yeah.
Seth: In him. So Joseph is the wise one filled with the Holy Spirit-
David: Mm
Seth: ... who's able to correctly interpret the dreams of the people.
David: Right.
Seth: So and when we, um, uh-Fast forward-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... into the New Testament.
David: Right.
Seth: Paul just heightens this and said, "There are rulers and authorities still, Roman officials, demonic forces-
David: Oh, right. Yeah
Seth: ... who are trying to, by their wisdom, control the world.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: They have particular visions of what they think the world's gonna do, but there's a wisdom that surpasses it all, and if they would've known the true wisdom, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
David: Wow.
Seth: Because when He dies, there's resurrection. And what's the story of Joseph over and over again? He's thrown into the pit, and then comes back out of it.
David: Right.
Seth: He's thrown into Egypt to resurrect the family line.
David: Daniel's thrown into the lions' den [laughs]
Seth: And he comes back out again.
David: Right.
Seth: That's exactly right.
David: That's really interesting.
Seth: And where does the wisdom come from? Doesn't come from the accumulated knowledge-
David: Nope
Seth: ... of Pharaoh's enchanters.
David: Right.
Seth: It doesn't come fr- from the books of the ma- of the, of the Babylonians-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... and their special dream interpretation journals. It comes from time spent with the Lord.
David: Right. It comes from the Spirit of God-
Seth: Comes-
David: ... revealing it to you.
Seth: What is Proverbs 1:1? Uh, the fear of the Lord is the-
David: Beginning of wisdom
Seth: ... beginning of wisdom.
David: Yeah.
Seth: What it, what brings true wisdom? A proper relationship with God.
David: Mm. Yeah, and what's, what's the basis of that fear that begins wisdom, that lets us see into these secret things of God? Is it like, like you've said, is it, is it trying harder or being better, like racking up all these more points?
Seth: The fact that he has just all this leadership capability-
David: Yeah [laughs]
Seth: ... just oozing out of him-
David: Yeah [laughs]
Seth: ... in the prison.
David: No, it's, it's trust. It's faith, that he is... I mean, imagine the trust and faith it would take to just, like, name it, right? Because I think-
Seth: Right
David: ... I think, uh, to name the interpretation, 'cause I think Pharaoh says, like, "If you're wrong, I'ma kill you," right? Is that, am I right?
Seth: That might be Daniel you're thinking of.
David: Oh, well, I mean, there you go. We were already talking about-
Seth: Right
David: ... Daniel. Yeah, so, but there's that idea that, like, you put a lot on the line whenever you're, you're giving people these kinds of interpretations, especially whenever it's Pharaoh, you know, the lead- the, you know, biggest, baddest leader in the land.
Seth: Right.
David: Um, I mean, what kind of trust and faith would you have to have that, like, "Did I just hear from the Lord about this-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... interpretation?" And, and so it's, it's just this fearful faith that Joseph had in his God that he would lead him to interpret these dreams correctly.
Seth: Yeah.
David: And so for us today, what... How, how do we look into the secret things of God and understand His plan from eternity past? Is it, is it by being the best biblical scholars in the world or being the most morally exemplary people? No. I mean, those are good things.
Seth: What did Joseph do?
David: Yeah.
Seth: He remembered God's past faithfulness to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.
David: Yeah.
Seth: So you and I do the same thing. We look back to the cross of Jesus Christ. Did He die? Yes. Did He rise from the dead? Yes. That is the true wisdom of God.
David: Yeah.
Seth: If you trust in that, if you believe that, if you meditate on it, if that becomes the engine of your life, motivating the things that you do, you become the wisest person-
David: [laughs]
Seth: ... in your corporation. You become the wisest person among your peers, not because you are smarter-
David: Right
Seth: ... but because you're d- diving into the heart of God, faithful even unto death. [gentle music]
David: Okay, so Joseph interprets these dreams of Pharaoh, and they're about, um, a pla- uh, not a plague, a famine, a famine-
Seth: A famine
David: ... that's about to take place. And so he-
Seth: Seven years of plenty-
David: Yep
Seth: ... seven years of famine.
David: And Joseph not only wisely, we talked about wisdom, not only wisely interprets the dream, he also wisely comes up with a plan for how to deal with the fact that there's going to be seven years of plenty and seven years of famine, right?
Seth: Right. This is when Pharaoh says it. He's like, "Can we find a man like this in whom the Spirit of God dwells?" Then Pharaoh said to Joseph, "Since God has shown you all this, there's none as discerning, as wise, than you are. You be in charge."
David: Yeah, so he-
Seth: [laughs] That's what he says
David: ... yeah, so he, he puts, he puts, he puts Joseph in charge, and Joseph decides that we're going to s- over, overstore, we're gonna-
Seth: Right
David: ... over save during the seven years of plenty so that we can have, have enough when the seven years of famine come.
Seth: Right.
David: So, yep.
Seth: And people can buy it back from us-
David: And we'll-
Seth: ... and you get wealthier, Pharaoh.
David: That's right, yeah.
Seth: Right.
David: Man.
Seth: Pharaoh likes this idea.
David: Yeah, he does.
Seth: Smart guy. [laughs]
David: Yeah. And so, um, and so the famine comes after the seven years of plenty, and it reaches the land where Jacob and his sons are. So this is Joseph's family, and, um, they are, like, starving out there. There's no food, and they hear that they can go to Egypt and buy some food.
Seth: Yep. So they walk all the way over there, and they bow themselves before him with their faces to the ground for six-
David: Uh-oh. There's the dream
Seth: ... the dream has been fulfilled.
David: That's what Joseph dreamed, yep.
Seth: Joseph knows it's th- his brothers, but the brothers don't know that it's him.
David: Right.
Seth: Um, and then more tricksy.
David: More tricksy. [laughs]
Seth: More tricksy. [laughs]
David: It has been the word of Genesis-
Seth: It is
David: ... is tricksy. Yeah, he, uh, so, yeah, so Joseph ends up say- like, he, he wants... 'Cause Benjamin didn't come, the youngest brother, right?
Seth: Right, he didn't come. He's-
David: Yeah, he didn't come because Jacob was fearful that, you know-
Seth: He would-
David: ... something bad would happen to him.
Seth: Right.
David: And so he, but Joseph loves Benjamin.
Seth: Yeah, he-
David: And, yeah
Seth: ... and he's just asking his brothers questions. "Is your father still alive?"
David: Right.
Seth: "Do you have any other brothers?" He's, like, questioning them.
David: He's giving them the third degree, but really he's like, "Hey, how's Dad?" You know? [laughs] Like, but they have no clue-
Seth: Yes
David: ... that's what's happening.
Seth: But he actually calls them spies, and it's-
David: Right
Seth: ... like cast as an interrogation.
David: Yes.
Seth: "You guys are spies. How many, how many siblings do you have?"
David: "How's your dad?"
Seth: "How, how's your dad?"
David: [laughs]
Seth: "Is he alive?"
David: Yep.
Seth: And, um-
David: And so basically he, they, they give him all these answers, and they're like-
Seth: And they, "Well, we-"
David: ... "well, we actually do have one more brother. His name's Benjamin. He's back home." And they give it-
Seth: And they even admit-
David: Yep
Seth: ... that there's one brother who is no more.
David: Who's not there.
Seth: And that's all they say.
David: Oh, who's, who's no more.
Seth: One is no more.
David: Right, yep.
Seth: And so in the narrative, this is im- actually pretty important.
David: Mm.
Seth: Because you see s- you still see a lack of repentance, a lack of remorse-
David: Oh, yeah
Seth: ... on the brothers' part. They won't even name-
David: Right
Seth: ... his brother.
David: Or let alone take ownership for-
Seth: Right
David: ... what happened to him.
Seth: "There is one who is no more."
David: Right. "Who knows what happened."
Seth: "Who knows what happened to him."
David: Yeah. Yeah.
Seth: And then throughout the r- throughout the story, they become more and more aware that what they did was wrong.
David: Yeah.
Seth: And they experience guilt for it, even down th- in verse 21. "In truth," they're trying to explain what's happening.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: They're, they're, they, they think they're about to die. They, they don't know what's gonna happen in Joseph's care. And they said, "In truth, we are guilty concerning our brother. Did I not tell you it was a sin against the boy? But you didn't listen to me."So they're processing, "Why is all this bad stuff happening to us in, in, in Egypt? Why are they interrogating me?"
David: Right.
Seth: "They've thrown one of our brothers into another pit-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... just like we threw Joseph into a pit."
David: Joseph into one, yeah.
Seth: Like, "Is, like, God punishing us with the same thing we did to Joseph?"
David: [laughs]
Seth: And so they're trying to process through, "Are we actually being punished for what we did?"
David: Right. Which is crazy that this is the first time that they might be actually coming to a realization about how terrible the thing they did to their brother [laughs] was.
Seth: Yes.
David: Like, "Man, could it be that we did something wrong to Joseph?" [laughs] Anyway, so they, Joseph says, uh, "You have to leave. Here's, here's your grain. You bought it. Now go, go away, and you-
Seth: "If you want your brother back."
David: Yeah, "You can't... Yeah, I, I've taken your brother..." Who's thrown in, uh-
Seth: It's Simeon.
David: Okay. Yeah.
Seth: And they start heading back home-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... with all the grain, and they get to a lodging place. They get to a halfway point, and they open up their bag, I guess, to eat some grain, and they find that all their money is still in the bags.
David: Yeah, Joseph had one of his servants put all the money they paid for the grain back in the bags, which was, like, his way of blessing them.
Seth: Right.
David: But they take it as a sign of like, "Oh, no, he's gonna think we stole all this money."
Seth: Right, and in their words, "What is this thing that God has done to us?" [laughs]
David: [laughs] And so they go back, and they're not allowed to go back to Egypt without Benjamin.
Seth: Right.
David: Because Joseph's like, "How do, how will I know who, who you, you are, who you say you are unless you bring this, this younger brother of yours?" So they go back. They, they, uh, tell Jacob, and Jacob's like, "Nope, you're not going back. You're not taking Benjamin."
Seth: "I'm not losing another son."
David: "I've already lost one son that I loved. I'm not losing another."
Seth: Well, you could say, "I've lost two sons now, Joseph and now Simeon."
David: Oh, and now Simeon.
Seth: Yeah.
David: "I'm not losing the third."
Seth: Right.
David: Yeah. And so, but food runs out-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... and they are forced to go back with Benjamin.
Seth: Both Reuben and Judah, who had a role, like a pretty active role-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... in sending Joseph over there, both offer to give up their own sons. Like, "If-
David: Oh, that's right
Seth: ... if you, if we don't come back with Benjamin, take it out on my sons."
David: Right.
Seth: So already we're seeing a little bit-
David: Some softness of heart and repentance.
Seth: Yes.
David: Yeah. Wow, and so they go back, and this time, Joseph welcomes them with, like, a feast.
Seth: Yeah, they're th- they're thrown off by this.
David: Definitely thrown off.
Seth: What's happening? Well, at first, when Joseph invites them to their house, they're like, "Oh, no."
David: He's gonna-
Seth: "He knows about the money."
David: Yeah, he knows about the money, right. [laughs]
Seth: "He knows about the money. He's gonna come and get us." And so they're worried that they're about to be slaughtered.
David: Oh, yeah.
Seth: Something's gonna happen to them.
David: Right.
Seth: But Joseph is ready to welcome them.
David: Yeah.
Seth: He... They come in with their big sacks of money, saying, "You, you paid us, you gave us the money back. There was a mistake, and so-
David: So all this time they've kept this money.
Seth: Which is impressive. [laughs]
David: That is impressive, actually.
Seth: And Joseph says, "No, that was God blessing you. I have your money. Don't worry about it." And he's, lays out this great feast for them.
David: Yeah.
Seth: Feeds all their donkeys.
David: Right.
Seth: And they just don't know what to do about it.
David: They're really uncomfortable during this whole thing.
Seth: They are.
David: And so they kinda eat. They, they buy more grain, and they're gonna leave again.
Seth: Right.
David: But Joseph-
Seth: Before they do, they bow again.
David: Oh, they bow again.
Seth: Second time.
David: Second dream.
Seth: Second time.
David: There we go. And Joseph plays another trick on them. This time, he puts his kind of prized silver cup-
Seth: Like, this is the cup that he drank out of-
David: Right
Seth: ... and apparently practiced divination out of as well.
David: [laughs]
Seth: I was like, "Okay, all right, cool,
David: whatever, you know, if that's your cup of tea, your silver cup of tea."
[laughs] Okay, nope, terrible. Okay.
David: But you, uh, but so they, he puts it in Benjamin's sack.
Seth: Right.
David: And they go away, and then he sends his guards after them, and they, they, they kind of, they accuse them of this, and they went, and they went, "No, we're, we're guiltless of this. We haven't done this thing. Search our sacks, and whoever, whoever's, uh, whoever's sack you find this cup in, they'll be your prisoner for life," or something like that, right?
Seth: Right.
David: Yeah, and so they search the sacks, and oh no, it's in baby Benjamin's sack.
Seth: It is.
David: The one dude-
Seth: They can't leave without
David: ... they can't, they can't go home without.
Seth: So they go back.
David: Because, like, if they go back, if they, if they go back without Benjamin, like-
Seth: They've promised to give up their own-
David: They've promised even their own sons
Seth: ... sons. And more than likely, that probably wouldn't happen.
David: Right.
Seth: But they would, they just know it would kill-
David: That would kill Jacob
Seth: ... it would kill their father.
David: Yeah, yes.
Seth: So they all go back to try to figure out what happened.
David: Right.
Seth: Uh-
David: And so they, they go back, and they're like, "We don't know how this happened." But Judah, remember Judah?
Seth: Yeah.
David: Judah and Tamar?
Seth: Yeah.
David: This dude who almost, uh, put to death by, like, uh, being burned by fire Tamar, who had his child in her.
Seth: Right, right, right.
David: Like, he, in a huge character swing, offers to give up his own life for that of Benjamin's.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Like, and which is so cool that this is the, this is the chosen seed. This is the one who will lead to Jesus. He is offering to do that which Jesus will ultimately do-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... which is give his life for, um, for others, right?
Seth: Right.
David: Yeah, pay the price-
Seth: Right
David: ... which is pretty cool.
Seth: It is pretty cool.
David: Yeah. And so, but anyway-
Seth: Joseph
David: ... Joseph is like-
Seth: When he's, finally sees this change-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... of heart in his brother-
David: Yep, that's the, that's the switch
Seth: ... he just starts crying-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... in front of them.
David: Yeah.
Seth: Bubbles over with compassion towards them-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... and says, "It's me. It's me."
David: "It's Joseph."
Seth: "It's Joseph."
David: Yeah.
Seth: And he, um, tells them that it's him, and he says, "Don't worry about all that's happened. God has sent me ahead of you to preserve your life."
David: Yes.
Seth: "That's the point. That's my-
David: Yes
Seth: ... purpose in life is to preserve life."
David: And that is the whole purpose of the Joseph story. It's the reason why we're following Joseph's story and not Judah's as closely.
Seth: Right.
David: Right? It's the reason why we're in Egypt and not over in the Promised Land with Jacob and his sons.
Seth: Yes.
David: Because God is trying to show us that he is providing for his people through very unlikely circumstances.
Seth: It's, right, it's the faithfulness of somebody else-
David: Right
Seth: ... who provides salvation for faithless people.
David: That's right.
Seth: Like-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... it's, [laughs] it's the story of Jesus.
David: Because-
Seth: Jesus's faithfulness provides salvation-
David: Yes
Seth: ... for faithful us.
David: That's right.
Seth: Jo- faithful Joseph provides salvation for faithless Judah.
David: Yeah, 'cause if you think about it, um, Jacob and his sons would've died out there. The promises of God would've been over. Genesis 3:15 would've been proven false unless God would've raised Joseph up through his brothers' evil and rose him through the ranks of the most prestigious and powerful empire on planet Earth in order to provide food for them, but also not only for them, this is also a, um, foreshadowing of God's promise to Abraham. He said, "I will make you a blessing to all nations."
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: And that is the word we get whenever we hear, who is it that came to Egypt to receive food during this famine? The whole earth.... the whole earth streamed to Joseph in order to be fed, and that is the picture that of-
Seth: You even-
David: ... of the whole Bible.
Seth: It is.
David: Yeah.
Seth: And you even have, like, a smaller picture of it when Jacob comes up and blesses Pharaoh. Remember this in chapter 47? Um, uh, Pharaoh-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... meets Joseph's father and says-
David: Ooh
Seth: ... like, "How long have you been alive?" Like, "120 years." And then his father says, "Let me bless you, Pharaoh."
David: Literally, it's the same words. [laughs]
Seth: [laughs] "Let me bless you," and he blesses-
David: Yes
Seth: ... Pharaoh.
David: Yeah.
Seth: Literally, the Bible-
David: Being a blessing to all nations
Seth: ... like, the promise of Abraham are coming true right in front of them.
David: Wow.
Seth: And in verse 27 of chapter 47, it says, "They went into the land of Go- Goshen, obtained possessions, and they were fruitful and multiplied greatly."
David: Right.
Seth: We had this expectation that Egypt is c- becoming the new Eden.
David: Yep.
Seth: Abraham, the heir of Abraham, is blessing the nations. All the nations of the world are coming to Egypt to receive grain-
David: There's lots of grain-
Seth: ... and blessing
David: ... and food there.
Seth: People are multiplying. Joseph, the faithful one, is reigning and-
David: Yep
Seth: ... ruling. There's a chosen seed in the- [laughs]
David: Yeah
Seth: ... in Egypt. We l- this is Eden.
David: Yes.
Seth: This is gonna be Eden.
David: Right, which is so crazy 'cause we've seen Eden have really firm boundaries, you know, the rest of Genesis. We've talked about that many times, where it's like, it's always this place, and make sure you come, you know, you go get the wife from, you know, Abraham's land, but make sure to come back here 'cause we have to stay here. But then we, we go to Egypt to this other place where when we turn the page into Exodus, this place sucks.
Seth: Right.
David: [laughs] Uh, but here it's like, man, God's building his kingdom here.
Seth: Right.
David: And, like, that's the picture of the whole Bible, is that the whole earth, even the worst places, will become like Eden, and all nations of the world will be blessed because they get to dwell with God because-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... of the, the work of the final chosen seed, Jesus.
Seth: I mean, there's even more hints at, than this. In chapter 46 verse, uh, 27-
David: Yep
Seth: ... it's just listing the genealogy of Joseph.
David: Right.
Seth: And there are 70-
David: Yes
Seth: ... descendants listed just like there were 70 sons of Adam listed. You're meant to see this as, hopefully, a new Eden.
David: Right.
Seth: But you're also clued in to the fact-
David: That it's not
Seth: ... that this might not be.
David: Because of-
Seth: Chapter 46-
David: That's right
Seth: ... uh, when God actually is reaffirming his covenant to, um, Jacob, he says, "Do not be afraid to go down to Egypt-
David: Right
Seth: ... for there I will make you a great nation." So you have to ask the question, why would, uh, God have to say-
David: Why would he be, not, why would he say, "Don't be afraid"? There's food there. [laughs]
Seth: There's food there. Your son's there.
David: Right.
Seth: Uh, your family will be there.
David: Right.
Seth: You're provided for.
David: It's 'cause-
Seth: You have a, a possession-
David: Yep
Seth: ... and a land.
David: It's 'cause Jacob's remembering a promise made to his grandpappy.
Seth: In Genesis 15:13-
David: [laughs] Right. Yep
Seth: ... where God says, "You will go down to Egypt, and you will be servants."
David: For 400 years.
Seth: "You will be slaves for 400 years." So you have what looks like Eden on the outside.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: But you also have this promise lingering in the background that 400 years of slavery also awaits God's chosen people-
David: Yep
Seth: ... in Egypt at the same time.
David: So why is he afraid? He's like, "This is where we're probably gonna go into slavery. That's terrifying." But what's amazing is he says, "There in Egypt, in slavery for 400 years, it's there that I'm going to start to fulfill the promise I made to Abraham to make you a great nation." 'Cause that's what we've been waiting for.
Seth: Right.
David: It's been, we, we've had a, a, a [laughs] kind of a lineage of scarcity so far. It's like, Abraham, you're, you're not gonna be able to even number how many kids you have. Like, look at all the stars. Look at the sands of the sea. That won't even compare to how many kids you have. Okay, you had one and just barely, you know, and then you had a few others. But, like-
Seth: Right
David: ... you, and then it's like, okay, we've got Jacob and y- y- or, or, uh, Isaac, you know, and then we've got Jacob and Esau, and it's like this, this kind of lineage of scarcity. And then, oh, then we have 12, but it's through slaves and multiple wives and all this other stuff. And then finally we get to Joseph, and we have 70, and we're like, okay, that's still more than 12, but that's a far cry from-
Seth: It's more than 12
David: ... outnumbering the-
Seth: Right
David: ... stars in the sky. And isn't it interesting that, that if the, if the main theme of Genesis is God using evil to bring about good, that it's in the midst of evil, in the belly of Egypt, uh, when they're enslaved and oppressed, that that is the place where God will actually turn Israel into the great nation that he promised to be.
Seth: And it's the same now.
David: Yeah.
Seth: It's only when we, we become slaves to Christ-
David: Mm
Seth: ... that we are free. What's, what does Paul say over and over again? "You are bond servants to Christ. You are slaves to Christ. You are not your own. You were bought with a price."
David: Bought with a price.
Seth: How do we experience freedom even today in Jesus? It's when we sell ourselves into slavery.
David: Mm.
Seth: It's only through slavery that freedom and redemption and the blessing of the whole world comes.
David: Yeah. And so we know that this, that not even Joseph and Jacob thought that this was gonna be Eden, that th- that's where they would end up, uh, because both of them, um, kind of have a similar command given to their family. Jacob says, "Don't you dare bury me here in Egypt. You take me back to Canaan, and you bury me there." And so, uh, Pharaoh outfits them with this whole caravan.
Seth: Right.
David: And they go, and they have, like, how, how many days? I can't remember. Just-
Seth: 70 days of mourning
David: ... 70 days of mourning, um, paid for by Pharaoh, [laughs] and this huge embalming ceremony for Jacob. He's buried there because he's like, "I'm n- I don't wanna be outside the promised land. I don't want-
Seth: Right
David: ... my body to be outside the promised land." So he's trusting that God is going to bring these people out o- of Egypt at one point and back in- into fulfilling what the promise that he made to him and to his father-
Seth: Right
David: ... and his grandfather. And then Joseph has a similar pronouncement. He's about to die, and he says, "When I die, you make sure you put my bones in a backpack and carry them out of this stinking land back to my, my father's promised land."
Seth: Right.
David: Yeah.
Seth: So as much as it looks like Eden, Joseph and Jacob still know that this isn't supposed to be.
David: Right.
Seth: That there is another land that God is promising to bring about, uh, his purposes to bless the whole world through, and that's what the Book of Exodus is about.
David: Yep.
Seth: How do they get into the promised land? How do they get from being 70 people-To a whole nation in the promised land. How do they escape slavery-
David: Yep
Seth: ... into the promised land to bless the whole world.
David: Yep, and that's what we find when we turn to the Book of Exodus. So it's been really great walking, uh, through the Book of Genesis. We're really thankful for, um, for y'all for, uh, listening through. Um, we, we've got lots of resources on the Book of Genesis, um, over at our website, spokengospel.com. Um, there is, uh, a, a video that maybe will be released by the time this comes out. I, I don't wanna do the math.
Seth: That's awesome.
David: Or soon, soon after. Uh, the book- the introduction to the Book of Genesis will be out soon. Um, there's s- like 20 or more devotionals coming out with these. So, um, you know-
Seth: As we speak right now, we are 99% funded for the G-
David: For the, that's, yeah
Seth: ... Genesis Studio.
David: For the Genesis introduction, yep.
Seth: We only need five people to donate-
David: 36 bucks
Seth: ... or to, to join us for $36 [laughs]
David: Yep.
Seth: And-
David: So yeah, if you, if you're, if you enjoy this podcast, if you like the resources we make, we invite you to go over to spokengospel.com/donate and, uh, become a monthly supporter to our work. Uh, all, everything you, you give goes straight to, um, our nonprofit, um, and goes to help make resources like these. So it's been a lot of fun going through Genesis.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Uh, and, uh-
Seth: And if you have no dollars, I do know you have fingers.
David: You have fingers.
Seth: And you can tap five stars.
David: That's right.
Seth: And you can also tap on your little keyboard and leave us a review. It actually really helps people-
David: Yes
Seth: ... to find us.
David: For the podcast here.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Yeah, that'd, that'd be really helpful. So, um, we've recorded Genesis now. We've gone through Exodus already-
Seth: We have
David: ... in the podcast. So we are jumping to Leviticus next.
Seth: We are.
David: So that'll be fun. So, uh, we, we really hope you would join us there as we, uh, walk through, uh, all of scripture, trying to show Jesus in every corner of it. Uh-
Seth: And the blood sacrifices. [laughs]
David: And the blood sacrifices. Should be a, should be a stretch for, for that. No, not really, but.
Seth: The dove sacrifice.
David: Yeah.
Seth: The bread sacrifice.
David: All of 'em.
Seth: The grain sacrifice.
David: Yeah. There's lots of 'em.
Seth: Smoke sacrifice.
David: Smoke sacrifice.
Seth: Is that a thing?
David: The wave offering.
Seth: The wave offering.
David: That's the weirdest one to me. But anyway, so we'll see you there hopefully in the book of Leviticus. So thank you guys, and bye. [upbeat music]
Outro: Thank you for listening to the Spoken Gospel podcast. Spoken Gospel is a nonprofit dedicated to creating free gospel-centered media that speaks the gospel out of every corner of scripture. So to join us in our mission and view our resources, we invite you to visit spokengospel.com. [upbeat music]
