David: [upbeat music] It's just so interesting to view Satan that way.
Seth: Mm.
David: The one who comes to us and whispers accusations in our ears and condemnation and says, "You are guilty. You are worthless. You're going to die."
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: "There is no God. There is no resurrection for you." And it's like, man, when Jesus rose from the grave, guess who went-
Seth: Mm
David: ... into the tomb after him? Satan.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: He casts Satan down.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: He defeats his accusations. We are proven innocent when we combine ourselves with him. When we are in Christ, we too are innocent, and Satan's accusations have nothing to do but be- to be thrown to the lions.
Intro: [upbeat music] Welcome to the Spoken Gospel Podcast. Spoken Gospel is a ministry that's dedicated to speaking the gospel out of every corner of scripture. In Luke 24, Jesus told his disciples that every part of the Bible was about him. So each week, hosts David and Seth work through a passage of scripture to see how it's all about Jesus and his Good News. Let's jump in.
David: [upbeat music] Well, welcome everyone to the Spoken Gospel podcast. Thank you so much for joining us. We are continuing our walk through the Book of Daniel now in chapter six with Daniel in the lion's den. Seth, how you feeling about this famous story?
Seth: I mean, I'm ready to get in the lion's den.
David: You're ready to get in the lion's den.
Seth: Because they're not gonna hurt me, because God's gonna close their mouth.
David: [laughs] Man, I have to say-
Seth: And I'm gonna be fine. [laughs]
David: You, as you started studying this and you were processing it with me, blew everything I thought about this story-
Seth: Really?
David: ... out of the water.
Seth: Really?
David: I never had understood it the way that most commentators understand it, and that is actually the right way to understand it.
Seth: Right.
David: You, like, laid it out for me. I was like, "I did not know this." So stick around and listen to this-
Seth: I'm, I'm excited
David: ... everyone 'cause it's super cool. It changes so much and adds m- so much detail and richness in the gospel to it. I'm very excited to share everything.
Seth: Yeah.
David: So.
Seth: Well, Daniel 6:1, it remi- well, let's go back. Before Daniel-
David: Right
Seth: ... 6:1.
David: 'Cause it's, yeah, 'cause it starts with the word, with, "It pleased Darius." Who's Darius? Where'd he come from?
Seth: At the very end of the last chapter, the Babylonian Empire falls to the Medes.
David: Right.
Seth: And King Darius inherits the throne of Babylon.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And now it's called the Median Empire.
David: Okay.
Seth: Um, and so-
David: It's not, it's not small.
Seth: It's not-
David: It's not large. It's median [laughs]
Seth: It's median. It's, it's a mina. [laughs] "And it pleased Darius to set over the kingdom 120 satraps to be throughout the whole kingdom." So he begins his administration by reorganizing-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... the political system of Babylon.
David: Which is just interesting too that it's 120 satraps, because as we talked about in the last episode, uh, with the me, uh, mene, mene, tekel, and parsin, the mene is a mina, which is 60.
Seth: Yes.
David: And it's repeated twice. 60 plus 60 is 120.
Seth: Yeah, and the very end of the dream, of the vision interpretation by Daniel to Belshazzar is, "Your kingdom will be divided-
David: Yep
Seth: ... to this new empire."
David: And so he has-
Seth: And he divides it
David: ... all 120.
Seth: [laughs] He divides it into 120 pieces.
David: Yeah. And another way to think about it too is, like, um, if the 60 is the weight that was to be expected of Belshazzar's reign-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... kind of compared to Nebuchadnezzar's-
Seth: Yeah, yeah, yeah
David: ... in his last days of being a humble king, um-
Seth: Oh
David: ... then Darius is measuring up in a sense.
Seth: He's twice the man that Belshazzar-
David: Right
Seth: ... or should've been or-
David: Yeah, should've been.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Yeah. So anyway, that's just a funny little extra corroboration of Daniel's interpretation of that vision.
Seth: If you haven't listened to the Daniel 5 podcast, go back.
David: That was a fun one.
Seth: That was fun. And that might make a little more sense to you. Anyway-
David: Yeah [laughs]
Seth: ... so Darius-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... Darius is re- distributing his political system, and over them he sets three high officials, of whom Daniel was one-
David: Mm
Seth: ... and whom these satraps should give an account so that the king might suffer no loss. So again, like we've talked about Daniel's favor among the kings of Babylon.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And now it's being shown in a new administration. What kind of advisor to the king changes with a military occupation?
David: Right.
Seth: I'm thi- I mean, right now we've talked a couple of times, like Ukraine and Russia are-
David: Mm
Seth: ... at it.
David: Right.
Seth: Just imagine the high vizier, the wise man of Ukraine.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And let's just say Russia wins.
David: Right.
Seth: That man being in Russia's court as well.
David: Right.
Seth: That's just-
David: It wouldn't happen.
Seth: It wouldn't happen.
David: Yeah.
Seth: A loyalist to Babylon should not be a good man in Media's court.
David: Right.
Seth: But favor, wisdom is-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... found in Daniel.
David: It's amazing.
Seth: Then the d- bec- Daniel becomes distinguished above all the other high officials, just like every time-
David: [laughs]
Seth: ... he's been placed in office beforehand.
David: Which again is, is just re-emphasizing, both those points are re-emphasizing the main thrust of this book, which is God is in control. He puts-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... people in the places that he wants, and he is able to set up kings and bring down kings.
Seth: Yes.
David: And so he is able to put Daniel in any kingdom that might come in a position of power because he's in control and because-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... his kingdom is actually the one over all kingdoms.
Seth: That's right. And if we wanna tease even next week a little bit, I think it's interesting that you have all these different kings being depicted like gods or beasts, but Daniel is a Jew.
David: Mm.
Seth: And he's a so- he's a son of man. He's a, he's a normal, he was a-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... Jew taken from Babylon, but he cont- or taken from Judah-
David: Mm
Seth: ... and he continues to be elevated over and over and over again.
David: Yeah.
Seth: In the very next chapter, there's this image of a son of man ascending to a throne, and in some ways-
David: Ruling over beasts
Seth: ... ruling over beasts. In some way, that's Daniel throughout the whole book.
David: Right.
Seth: He's a man, a Jew-
David: Mm
Seth: ... elevated over and over again among these beast-like kingdoms.
David: Right.
Seth: Anyway.
David: Yeah. That's really good. Yeah.
Seth: We'll talk about it next week. Um, and the king planned to set him over the whole kingdom.
David: Mm.
Seth: Uh, the p- the prime minister of Media. "Then the officials and the satraps sought to find a ground for complaint against Daniel with regard to the kingdom, but they could find no ground for complaint or fault, because he was faithful and no error or fault was found in him."He's too good of a man.
David: Yes.
Seth: There's no dirt on Daniel.
David: Right. And they're so jealous of him.
Seth: Again, just like they were when Nebuchadnezzar was ruling.
David: Right.
Seth: History's repeating itself.
David: Okay. Yeah.
Seth: Do you have a, a thought?
David: Well, I have just Jesus thoughts in my head.
Seth: Jesus thoughts.
David: I have gospel thoughts in my head. As visions of gospel thoughts dance through my head.
Seth: [laughs] Towards, as they do. [laughs] Um, and so these men said, "Well, we are not gonna find any grounds for complaint against Daniel as it ru- pertains to the ruling."
David: Right, so they have to set a trap.
Seth: So they set a trap with connection to the laws of his God.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: So they want to trap Daniel-
David: In legalese
Seth: ... in legalese, and particularly worship of his God, which again, was on the line-
David: Ah
Seth: ... in, in Daniel chapter 1. So you have a new kingdom, a new empire. You have a new test.
David: Oh, right. This is a new test.
Seth: Right. It's a new-
David: This is the, the broccoli and water again.
Seth: It's the broccoli and water.
David: [laughs]
Seth: And so it's gonna be a... And the first one was about the, the food laws.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Defiling yourself with the food laws, the laws of his food, of God's-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... the laws of God as pertaining to food in chapter one.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Now the laws of God are up for debate again. Will Daniel be faithful to God, or will he be faithful to Darius? So they go to Darius, and they offer Darius a flattering proposition.
David: Yeah. They say that they wanna set up a law in the land that makes it so no one can pray to the gods except through him as their mediator, as their intercessor.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: Which again-
Seth: For 30 days.
David: For 30 da- [laughs] For 30 days.
Seth: [laughs]
David: Like, what? It's just ti- time runs out, like he couldn't handle more than 30 days [laughs]
Seth: [laughs]
David: Like a intercessor.
David: But it is interesting that the problem again and again and again throughout Daniel with these kings have been that they set themselves up in God's position.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: Um, eh, whether it's through a giant statue-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... or through claiming that th- in pride that they actually have all power instead of God, or using the vessels for their rompous parties.
Seth: Yep.
David: They keep trying to set themselves in the place of God, and again, you know, I have to dip into the New Testament to do this, but there is no mediator between God and man-
Seth: Right. [laughs] Okay
David: ... other than Jesus-
Seth: Right
David: ... other than God himself. And so they were offering Darius a chance to be God, and which is a funny thing too, they're offering him the same temptation that was in the garden.
Seth: Oh.
David: "Don't you wanna be like God?"
Seth: Yeah.
David: Like, "Wouldn't that be cool?"
Seth: That is interesting.
David: And he's like, "Oh, sure," and he goes along with it.
Seth: Yeah.
David: So Darius goes along with the plan.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: Is there any other wrinkle in there?
Seth: Well, I think we should talk about what does it mean for Darius to be the mediator between the gods and-
David: Okay
Seth: ... the Median empire?
David: Yeah.
Seth: So, like, I was like, 'cause I think normally when I read this story for the first time, I was like, no one can-
David: Pray to in, anyone but Darius
Seth: ... right. So Darius is God, and he's gonna grant all the requests to Babylon.
David: Right. Mm-hmm.
Seth: No, I don't think that's-
David: Right
Seth: ... what's on the line. It's that the kings were seen as divine beings.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And praying in Darius's name-
David: Yes
Seth: ... is-
David: In Darius' name, amen
Seth: ... in Darius' name, amen. That's the only prayer you could... For 30 days, it was, it was flattery, one.
David: Right.
Seth: Because he's a new, he's a new emperor.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: We need to flatter the new emperor. What better way to consolidate-
David: Consolidate power
Seth: ... power in the kingdom than for the whole-
David: For all languages to say one name
Seth: ... all, right.
David: Yeah.
Seth: Exactly. In Darius's name alone we pray. So that could look like bringing gifts to the king and making petitions in front of the king, and you make an offering in front of the king.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: But really, this is mostly a symbolic gesture because-
David: Right
Seth: ... Darius and these court officials aren't gonna be presiding over the private-
David: Every prayer. [laughs]
Seth: ... prayer or even the public temple prayers-
David: Right
Seth: ... throughout the entire province. It's a symbolic gesture-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... meant to, to play to Darius's vanity.
David: Right, and it's just meant to trap one person.
Seth: And it's just meant to trap one person.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: But an interest- the wrinkle is if they don't do it, they can be thrown to the lions.
David: Right.
Seth: So w- it's like-
David: Why, yeah, why this, why this punishment for breaking that law? And that would be the wrong question to ask.
Seth: Right.
David: Yes.
Seth: So, so a couple-
David: That's how I've always viewed it, though.
Seth: Right. That's why-
David: It was always viewed as, don't do it or you'll get thrown to the lions.
Seth: If we catch you praying in Yahweh's name, to the lions you go.
David: Right.
Seth: Right.
David: It's, it's law punishment.
Seth: Yeah. I think there's a little bit, it's a little more complicated-
David: Yes
Seth: ... than that. One, it's like-
David: And this, and just so everyone knows, this is what I was talking about at the beginning that blew my mind
Seth: ... I think it's less like, "Hey, you can only pray in Darius's name. If we catch you, you're gonna go to the lions."
David: Yeah, that's the punishment.
Seth: That's the punishment. I think it's more like a trial by ordeal.
David: Right.
Seth: Like, it's, it's more like a witch trial-
David: Yes
Seth: ... than it is like anything else. Because just on a, like a most basic level, how do you know, how can anyone know in whose name you're praying?
David: You can't. It's a private prayer. You, yeah, you just, you couldn't do it. It'd be impossible.
Seth: So you need a way to determine guilt or innocence.
David: That's right. You need a trial by ordeal.
Seth: So the trial by ordeal is the trial by lions.
David: Right. You, if we suspect that you have prayed in someone's name other than Darius-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... we throw you to the lions.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: If they eat you, you were guilty.
Seth: If they-
David: If they don't eat you, somehow-
Seth: Well, great
David: ... you're innocent
Seth: ... you're innocent. [laughs] It's-
David: This is, this is like the old witch hunts where they would like-
Seth: That's right
David: ... throw people into a river, and if you survived the river, oh, great, you're not a witch.
Seth: Right.
David: If you sank and drowned, which is most likely-
Seth: Right
David: ... you are, oh, I guess you're a witch.
Seth: Or no, if you floated, you-
David: Oh, you were a witch. But like, that's the only way you're gonna survive-
Seth: Survive
David: ... is if you float
Seth: ... so you have to, you have to drown
David: ... so you have to drown. You're, it's a catch-22.
Seth: It's a catch-22, and it's designed to, like, affirm the deity-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... or the divinity of Darius.
David: Yeah, another wrinkle to throw in this that's really interesting, and also just to help us further embody this imaginative universe of trial by ordeal, we actually have in the, i- in the Torah a trial by ordeal commanded by God.
Seth: Yes.
David: If you suspected a woman of adultery-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... um, y- but you couldn't prove it, but you had this-
Seth: Right
David: ... you, you suspected, you could bring her into the temple, and the priest would, would get a cup of water-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... and a little bit of dust from the temple floor and sprinkle it into the water. So it's like a little bit of, like, dusty water. It's not gonna hurt you.
Seth: Holy water. It's k-
David: It's, it's not a big deal. It's holy water.
Seth: Yes.
David: And they drink it, and now nor- in normal circumstances-
Seth: Nothing will ever happen
David: Nothing would ever happen. So this is the exact opposite of the trial by lions.
Seth: It's a trial by ordeal meant to exonerate the woman-
David: Right
Seth: ... being accused.
David: It is meant to prove the woman's innocence.
Seth: Yes.
David: And it's like, but if she is guilty, somehow God will miraculously work-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... to give her these intense stomach cramps.
Seth: Right.
David: And it will also dry up her womb, it s- it says.
Seth: I see. It's, it's in-
David: And so it's like, it's the exact opposite. This one is rigged to be like, you go to lions, you die-
Seth: Right
David: ... most of the time.
Seth: So it's-
David: Not, it's not an innocent cup of water.
Seth: Right.
David: It's lions.
Seth: Yes. Yeah.
David: Okay.
Seth: So the point there is that we have a category for a trial by ordeal within scripture.
David: Yes.
Seth: There are examples throughout human history, like the witch trials-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... where you trial by ordeal.
David: Right.
Seth: And this is another one of them.
David: Right.
Seth: How are we gonna prove that Darius is the ca- the god above all gods? How are we gonna prove that Darius is the mediator? How are we gonna prove that you prayed in the wrong name? Well, we'll throw you to lions.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And if you survive, then maybe you're innocent.
David: Yeah.
Seth: Maybe your god is the god of gods. So-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... both things are on the line. Daniel's innocence is on the line.
David: Mm.
Seth: But so are the claims that Yahweh-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... can be accessed without Darius. Like-
David: Yeah, right
Seth: ... like the, the, so is the claim that Darius is a mediator.
David: That's right.
Seth: But those-
David: They have to, yeah, they, God has to disprove that Darius is who his satraps are claiming to be.
Seth: That's right.
David: Yeah. It's also interesting, um, the comparison between the furnace-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... and the lions' den here.
Seth: Yeah.
David: I'm just thinking about this big, giant, hot furnace in the middle of Babylon, uh, as this symbol of their might and their power.
Seth: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
David: And then you have this big, ravenous cave full of lions as a symbol of Darius's-
Seth: Yes
David: ... and the Medians' might. Just these two centers of, of-
Seth: Right
David: ... death and power and control.
Seth: Yeah. Yeah, it's like they have these, [laughs] I keep thinking about the Rancor pit.
David: Oh, yeah.
Seth: The, the Book of Boba Fett. [laughs]
David: Or from, or from-
Seth: Return of the Jedi
David: ... Star Wars. Yeah, Return of the Jedi, yeah.
Seth: Return to, Jedi, yeah. Like, yeah, that's where you go to-
David: To die
Seth: ... to die. [laughs]
David: Yeah, it's not like Jabba was throwing people to the Rancor to see if they were innocent or not.
Seth: [laughs] I mean, Luke made it out.
David: He did. He was innocent.
Seth: Yeah, he was innocent. [laughs]
David: [laughs] Oh, I could keep going with that.
Seth: So what's on the line?
David: Yeah.
Seth: Daniel's innocence-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... and Darius's claim to be mediator.
David: Right.
Seth: The lions will apparently prove who's innocent and who is the true god.
David: And the expectation is they've rigged the system-
Seth: So that Darius is proved to be the mediator-
David: Yes
Seth: ... and Daniel will be guilty.
David: That's right.
Seth: So when Daniel knew that the document had been signed, he went to his house, where his window, he had his windows in his upper chamber, and opened towards Jerusalem.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: He got down on his knees three times a day, and he prayed and gave thanks before his God, as he had done previously.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: So what, so we just have a claim that Darius is the only mediator, and Daniel goes immediately and prays in a different direction.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: He prays towards Jerusalem.
David: Not toward the center of power in Darius's kingdom-
Seth: Right
David: ... but toward the center of power in God's kingdom.
Seth: Right, and what's interesting about that is that at this point, Jerusalem is burned, the temple is destroyed, there are no priests to act as his mediators between himself and God.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Darius is the only m- flesh and blood mediator around, right?
David: Right. Yep.
Seth: So he is praying in defiance of the order-
David: Right
Seth: ... but in hopes of a mediator yet to come.
David: Yeah, and I think it's important here to, to name the temple, you know, for an Israelite, was their place of mediation-
Seth: Right
David: ... between themselves and God.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: It was the place where their sins were atoned for. It was the place where they could literally go near the presence of the glory of God and have a picnic with him.
Seth: Yeah. It was also where you were declared innocent.
David: Right.
Seth: You would go to the temple-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... you would offer sacrifices, and the priest, the mediator-
David: Yep
Seth: ... would declare you innocent.
David: That's right. Yeah, it's where you went to be declared innocent.
Seth: Right.
David: Uh, or in the trial by ordeal for the woman suspected of adultery-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... that's where they would go to be clea- to be declared-
Seth: Yes
David: ... innocent or guilty as well.
Seth: That's right.
David: Yeah, so that is the place for a Jew to look for mediation, and that place... But the, but the interesting wrinkle is that place does not exist right now.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: It has been decimated by Babylon and still lies in ruins. So why is Daniel praying toward a building that doesn't exist anymore, where priests aren't actually doing mediation, and there are no sacrifices to make atonement?
Seth: I, I mean-
David: I'm setting you up.
Seth: You're setting me up.
David: [laughs]
Seth: Daniel's praying towards a future city, a future temple, a future priest-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... a future sacrifice that would prove him innocent and vindicate him before his enemies. I think Daniel is praying to Jesus-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... even though he didn't know his name.
David: That's right.
Seth: I think that's what's happening in this moment.
David: Yeah. And he doesn't know what it's gonna look like. You know, maybe he was imagining a restored temple-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... or, and a new high priest.
Seth: Yeah.
David: But at the end of the day, all those things are fulfilled in Jesus.
Seth: Yes, he knows Jesus, or this figure-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... this mediator, will rescue him from his accusers-
David: Yes
Seth: ... prove his innocence, and prove that God is the only god of, of, of, of media.
David: Yes, and to double down on that point, actually, I can almost argue with myself that Daniel probably did have a clearer vision of Jesus than maybe anyone else in his time, because we have to remember, Daniel doesn't follow a strictly chronological ordering, and Daniel 6 actually happens after Daniel 7.
Seth: That's right. That's right. That's right.
David: And so Daniel 7, Daniel has already had the vision of the Son of Man coming down from the clouds to-
Seth: Reigning from his judge's throne.
David: Right.
Seth: Right.
David: He knows what the final temple's going to look like.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: It's going to look like God reigning on high above everything and giving the thrones of, of, of the world to, to his saints. Like, he knows what it's going to look like, so he's praying towards the temple with that image in his mind. He's like, "I know, Son of God, that you will reign forever."So I'm gonna pray to you, my only mediator.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: He did know that there was one who mediated between God and man
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... the Son of Man that he saw ride on the clouds-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... in the next chapter.
Seth: Yeah.
David: 'Cause this has already happened.
Seth: Yeah.
David: So he is praying to Jesus. [laughs]
Seth: He's praying to Jesus.
David: Like, he is. This is the second person of the Trinity. He's doing that.
Seth: That's yeah, cool. It's so cool.
David: Yeah, and so he does this. Eh, what, eh, I wa- I just wanna stop and say, like, why did he do it? 'Cause I've heard so many-
Seth: Oh
David: ... VBS kind of like-
Seth: Okay
David: ... Bible school stories about-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... des- you know, despite the warning-
Seth: Right
David: ... he went and did it anyway. Uh, eh, eh, I've heard people talk about it as an act of civil disobedience.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: Where it's, it's an-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... unjust law, and so in an act of civil disobedience, he goes and breaks the law on purpose in order to show that he's a faithful Jew.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: Uh, uh, I think, I think those are okay.
Seth: Yeah.
David: I'm not- I don't have a problem with those.
Seth: Well, I think the best way to interpret Daniel 6-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... is to look at its mirror passage in Daniel chapter 3.
David: Which is the-
Seth: The-
David: ... fiery furnace
Seth: ... the fiery, fiery furnace.
David: Okay.
Seth: We've talked about this multiple times already in this series, but this section of, the- the Book of Daniel's arranged like a chiasm-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... where every chapter has a partner chapter elsewhere-
David: Right
Seth: ... in the book. Chapter 3 and chapter 6 are mirror images of each other.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: You have Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego before a king claiming to be the final word, to be the image of God-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... the final word on who rules the world, and they have a choice. Do they bow to him or do they not? And now we have a similar situation. You have a king claiming to be the only mediator between the gods and men.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And he has a choice in that moment. It's a p- private choice in this matter, not a public choice like it was for Sha- Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego.
David: Right.
Seth: But he still has a choice. It sounds like it c- it was a private thing on the line. He didn't ha- he didn't have to. He could have not prayed for 30 days.
David: Right.
Seth: Or he could have-
David: He could've prayed with the window shut
Seth: ... could have prayed with the window shut.
David: [laughs]
Seth: He could have, uh, but he is making a stand.
David: He is giving-
Seth: He's allegiance to the right king.
David: He's wanting God to go public.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Like, he's wanting his allegiance, and he's wanting to stand up for God-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... in a public way. Or he-
Seth: I think, I think he is
David: ... he wants to pass the test.
Seth: Right.
David: He want, like-
Seth: Right. He wants to pass the test
David: ... he knows what he's facing right now is a test of his-
Seth: Right
David: ... of his-
Seth: And it is the same thing. It's not like, um, the same thing happens with Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego. They didn't go to the king and be like, "Oh, we're not-"
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... "gonna bow down, sucker."
David: Right.
Seth: Right? They were dragged there-
David: Right
Seth: ... by conspirators.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And they were like, "Hey, these Jews won't do it." Same thing happens. This Jew won't do it.
David: Yep.
Seth: So same thing happens. I, I was wondering, the one thing-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... I was just, like, curious about that I've not thought of in Daniel's act of civil disobedience or setting himself up to pass the test-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... or whatever it is, is he knows this is a trap for him.
David: Oh.
Seth: Right? I, I think even if he didn't pray, they would've grabbed him anyway. [laughs]
David: Right.
Seth: Right? Like, it was designed for him.
David: Right.
Seth: It was a law designed to put him in a den of lions, and so he's gonna get there anyway. So I think he is praying for the Son of Man to come and save him.
David: Mm. Yeah.
Seth: Like, he's asking for mediation.
David: You would assume as the third leader of the kingdom with the promise of being the prime minister, you would know the hundred, the, the, the poli- politics of your 120.
Seth: Yeah.
David: You know what's happening at this moment.
Seth: Oh yeah, you know they're coming for you.
David: You know they're coming for you.
Seth: And so what does he do? Does he go jockey for position with the king? Does he go try to overturn the law?
David: No.
Seth: Does he, does he legislate? Does he do politics?
David: No.
Seth: He prays.
David: He prays.
Seth: And he asks for mediation from the one who is actually the mediator.
David: The one who can prove him innocent.
Seth: Yeah, and he, and we're gonna see, he gets proved innocent-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... because he went to the right place for mediation.
David: Mm.
Seth: So the men come by agreement and come before the king and said, "Did you not sign an injunction that anyone who makes petition to any god or man within 30 days except you shall be cast into the den of lions?" And the king, not knowing what they're talking about, says-
David: Mm
Seth: ... "Yes, that's, the m- laws of the Medes and the Persians cannot be revoked," which is interesting.
David: Mm.
Seth: Because he's like saying, "No, the laws are immutable. The laws cannot be changed. Nothing overturns the godlike laws-
David: Right
Seth: ... of the Medes." Then they answer and said, "Well, Daniel, who's one of the exiles from Judah, pays no attention to you, oh king. And then the king, and but he makes his petitions three times a day to a different god." Then the king, when he heard these words, was much distressed and set his mind to deliver Daniel, which is interesting.
David: Mm.
Seth: The king is trapped, too.
David: Yeah.
Seth: The king, kind of like, um, he had all that political infighting in, in Daniel 3 that kind of forces the, Nebuchadnezzar's hand into making, like, he didn't want to burn them, but you know, like, the, he made this public spectacle.
David: Right.
Seth: He has to burn them.
David: Yeah, he's kind of bound by his own honor and pride. [gentle music]
Seth: And so we have Darius being really soft-hearted, and he tries to save Daniel-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... from the fate that he knows he's trapped in.
David: Yeah. Can you, will you allow me to go down a gospel rabbit trail?
Seth: Of course.
David: Okay. I think it's interesting. I've never thought about this, but it's interesting that you have the, the king pretending to be God, who's bound by law to put the Christ figure in this thing to death-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... by the law-
Seth: Right
David: ... but then wants to deliver him.
Seth: Yeah.
David: But, like, his law was self-aggrandizing, and it was all about his ego, and he actually could break it-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... but he would just lose face a little bit, you know?
Seth: Yeah.
David: So it's just his ego is the thing that's tying it all up. There's only one law that actually is unchangeable, that actually-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... must be meted out perfectly for all time. That's the law of God.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: And h- instead of Jesus being, like, trapped by the law, Jesus willingly came to fulfill the law and-
Seth: Mm
David: ... went to death under the law of God, the immutable law of God.
Seth: Mm.
David: And then God did seek a way to bring him out in resurrection.
Seth: Right.
David: I was like, "Oh, this is like a..."
Seth: ... really nasty version
David: Right
Seth: And maybe even a version of how people try to view God today.
David: Yeah. It goes back to the theme we keep thinking about, where the kings seem to be like gods, and the gods seem to be setting up anti-Edens and blessing the whole world. These kings seem to be in the position of God over and over again. And I think what you're saying is, like, a lot of people wanna- the way that the story goes is, like, God's character demands justice.
Seth: Right.
David: So how does... But humanity is too imperfect to escape justice.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: So how can the law of God r- be revoked? The law of God stands forever.
Seth: Right.
David: It cannot be rescinded.
Seth: Right.
David: So how do you get out of it?
Seth: Yeah.
David: That's, uh, is that kinda like-
Seth: Yeah, that's totally it.
David: Yeah.
Seth: And what's amazing is he doesn't trap us in the law.
David: Mm.
Seth: Right? [laughs]
David: Right.
Seth: He sends us the one who can get us out of the law. He sends one who does actually s-
David: Mm
Seth: ... like, be judged by the law and is proven innocent.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: He goes into-
David: Mm
Seth: ... the lions' den, and under the law of God, the actually only immutable, eternal law of God, is proven innocent-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... so that we, who would be trapped by the law-
David: Right
Seth: ... can escape the lions' den too.
David: Right, which is how, uh, the story ends-
Seth: Right
David: ... where Darius praising the God of Israel and vindicating all believers-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... in Yahweh throughout the empire of Media.
Seth: Right.
David: Yeah.
Seth: I just, I've, I haven't read the story with the law in my mind.
David: Mm. I haven't either.
Seth: The Old Testament law in my mind.
David: Mm.
Seth: So anyway, and that super fulfills that.
David: That's interesting.
Seth: I think there's something there.
David: There is something there.
Seth: So okay. Uh, so Darius is looking for a way to get Daniel out, but he can't. He's trapped by his own law.
David: It is funny. It is just funny to see this would-be god i- like, made impotent by his own om-
Seth: Potence [laughs]
David: ... like by his own omnipotence.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Like, he's legislated himself into ir- irrelevance.
Seth: Right.
David: [laughs] Which is so interesting.
Seth: Well, it's funny. With like k- the kings of the earth legislate themselves into a corner.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: And when God legislates himself into a corner with his justice, he, he can't.
David: Right.
Seth: His, like, he sends himself-
David: Right
Seth: ... to do the work. King Darius can't go to the...
David: Well, he could have.
Seth: I guess he could have.
David: But he's too proud.
Seth: Mm.
David: Like, he could've been like, "You know what? It's my, it was my name that I was asking people to pray, and I'll lay my life down."
Seth: Yeah.
David: But he didn't, 'cause no one is like Jesus. [laughs]
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: Like, anyway, it's just-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... it's amazing.
Seth: So verse 16.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: "The king has no choice. He declares to Daniel, 'May your God, whom you serve continually, deliver you.'" I think this depiction of Darius is fascinating.
David: It really is.
Seth: Darius is not... He's a bad guy.
David: Yeah.
Seth: But he is super sympathetic to Daniel.
David: Yeah.
Seth: He contin- he seems to be praying. He goes, he, in a second, he's gonna fast-
David: Mm
Seth: ... all night long in hopes of Daniel's salvation. And by the way, we talked about this as a trial by ordeal. If this was just a punishment for not praying to Darius, why does he expect Daniel to come out the other side?
David: He wouldn't. He would just stay in there till he died.
Seth: Right. No, no, the point is that it's not, this isn't as, an execution.
David: Right.
Seth: This is, is Daniel innocent or guilty of the crimes the satraps are accusing him of?
David: Right, 'cause the next morning, apparently the king is fully within his legal right to go open the lions' den and then say-
Seth: And see if he's okay
David: ... he's okay.
Seth: Right.
David: Right. The trial was over.
Seth: The trial was over.
David: Yeah.
Seth: Did you survive the trial, Daniel?
David: Right.
Seth: Right. Are you innocent? Is your god really God? Like-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... oh. Okay. So a stone is brought in, laid over the roof of the den, or Daniel's thrown in.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: Stone is rolled over the top of it. Um, and the king signs his own signet in wax over the, the tomb.
David: Mm.
Seth: Isn't that, like, such a symbolic gesture?
David: He's, like, forced to bless this trial.
Seth: To bless the trial.
David: Huh.
Seth: It's kind of li- I, it, it makes me think of Pilate.
David: Sure.
Seth: You have this-
David: He wanted to wash his hands of it
Seth: ... you have this sympathetic type of character who's being forced by-
David: Mm
Seth: ... the religious Gestapo [laughs] to, you know, like, to, to force, you know, you know what I mean? Like-
David: Yeah, totally
Seth: ... he's forced to give his blessing on it even though he wants to wash his hands of it.
David: Right.
Seth: It's interesting.
David: That is interesting.
Seth: "Then the king went to his palace and spent the night fasting. No diversions were brought to him, and sleep fled from him." So he's praying on behalf of Dan- fasting on behalf of Daniel.
David: So that's ironic. You have the one man whom was, who was supposed to be everyone else's mediator mediating behalf of-
Seth: [laughs]
David: ... Daniel to the God who is the only mediator. [laughs]
Seth: Right.
David: It's so ironic.
Seth: Every-
David: It, it's also funny too that it's also, it's actually is what happened.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: Is like, "Hey, Darius, you be the mediator between God and man." And now Darius is being the mediator between Daniel and God.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: He's literally praying for Daniel, mediating for him, interceding for him.
Seth: Mm.
David: It's an ironic fulfillment-
Seth: Right
David: ... of the trap.
Seth: Yeah.
David: But it's going to undo the very trap that was set by the reversal. It's so interesting. [laughs]
Seth: It's so interesting. Well, what, as soon as you have that category of, like, mediation is on the line, and the king and the satraps have a broken relationship with mediation, and that false mediation is gonna be revealed and then corrected.
David: Mm.
Seth: And s- you know, like-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... and so all that's at work behind the scenes here. So the break of day comes, king goes down to the den of lions. He comes near the den of lions. He says, "Cast the stone off the top." And he cries out, "Daniel, servant of the living God."
David: Mm.
Seth: S- that's the same way that Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego are described, and it's the same way the, Moses and Abraham are described-
David: Mm
Seth: ... about God. These are-
David: The servants
Seth: ... the servants of God.
David: Mm.
Seth: The leaders of God's people. Um-
David: It's also funny that he's assuming life 'cause he says, "Servant of the living God."
Seth: Of the living God, right, in a place where you should totally have-
David: Sh- you should totally expect death. They're lions
Seth: ... "Has your God, whom you serve continually, been able to deliver you from the trial of lions?"
David: Mm.
Seth: "O king, live forever. My God sent his angel just like God sent one like the Son of the Gods into the fire to shut the lions' mouth."
David: Mm.
Seth: "And they have not harmed me. No scratch is on me.
David:"Yeah, that's amazing. Just like they, there was no singed smell-
Seth: That's right
David: ... on their clothes from the fiery furnace.
Seth: Yes. So the king calls Daniel up out of the lion's den. He's, you know, like resurrected-
David: Right
Seth: ... from the tomb, and no harm is found on him, and then the men who accused Daniel are thrown into the den of the lions, along with their families.
David: Mm.
Seth: And before they reach the bottom, the lions overpower them and break all their bones to pieces.
David: The lions were hungry.
Seth: The lions were hungry. This, the, yeah, the king didn't drug the lions the night before.
David: Right. [laughs] Right.
Seth: He didn't put some magic mushrooms down there and just... We're watching this documentary about-
David: [laughs]
Seth: ... fantastic fungi-
David: Oh, yes
Seth: ... on Netflix. [laughs]
David: [laughs]
Seth: And it's like this guy had, like, this spiritual experience on mushrooms, and he's like, "You can give mushrooms to anything."
David: Like a lion.
Seth: Like a lion. [laughs]
David: And they were just-
Seth: He trips out
David: ... they were just tripping out all night.
Seth: [laughs] No, an angel stopped the lions.
David: So Daniel is proven innocent.
Seth: Yes, the lions prove Daniel innocent.
David: Yes. Right.
Seth: The rigged trial backfires-
David: Right
Seth: ... and the people who tried to try Daniel-
David: [laughs]
Seth: ... are trapped by their own false trial.
David: Right.
Seth: They are proven guilt-
David: Wow, say, say that again.
Seth: No.
David: [laughs]
Seth: No. I, I said it by demo at one point. Maybe I could've said it better, clear, more clearly there. But the idea is that they're consumed by their own trial.
David: Mm.
Seth: Should we talk about Jesus?
David: Can we... I don't know how else to process this.
Seth: Okay. So just like there's jealous conspirators in Daniel-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... we have jealous conspirators in the Pharisees, who want Jesus torn to shred at the hands of another empire.
David: Right.
Seth: The Romans.
David: And, and they have to start doing political maneuvering and, and make a rigged trial because of the exact same reason.
Seth: Mm, mm-hmm.
David: They decide they wanna kill Jesus, but they are unable to find anything to stick on him.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: And so they're like, "We can't go about this by normal adjudication."
Seth: Right.
David: And so they have to form a rigged trial-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... to make him fall into their trap. Yeah, not only was the trial rigged, the accusation of blasphemy is also kinda rigged. It's this, you know, it's like, it's a rigged, everything's rigged about it. There's nothing-
David: Right... there's like, because he is the Son of God-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... and they're, like, asking him to identify himself as he is.
Seth: Right.
David: He will drown.
Seth: He will drown.
David: He will get eaten by lions. Like-
Seth: Yes
David: ... it's a rigged trial.
Seth: And so when the Pharisees, we don't... The, the crucifixion, to the Pharisees, was an execution.
David: That's right. It was not a trial.
Seth: But to God, it's a trial.
David: That's right. [laughs]
Seth: Like, whenever the Pharisees started the trial, it's like God honored the trial-
David: Mm-hmm
Seth: ... in the same way that God kinda honors the trial of these satraps.
David: Right.
Seth: He lets it go all the way to the grave.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: God honors the trial all the way to the grave of Jesus, and just like a stone is rolled over Daniel's tomb, a stone is rolled over Jesus'. But-
David: Yeah, but it, what's, what's funny here is you have the, the women coming to the tomb of Jesus, kind of like Darius comes to the den-
Seth: Yes
David: ... of Daniel.
Seth: Yes.
David: And the women come in a different way than Daniel.
Seth: Yeah.
David: It's also, it, it kinda makes sense of why Mark ends his gospel the way that he does, that the women who come to the tomb, they're looking for a dead body.
Seth: Right.
David: They're expecting Jesus to have e- been executed-
Seth: Mm
David: ... and not to have passed a trial.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: Even though he told them he was going to be resurrected.
Seth: Yes.
David: Whereas Darius, when he comes to the tomb, he's like, "Daniel, you're in there, right? I've been praying for you all night. I'm expecting your God to deliver you. You're in there, right?"
Seth: Yeah.
David: And the women come to the tomb of Jesus, and they're confronted by an angel, kind of like Daniel was accompanied by an angel-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... in his den, and the, the angel asks him this strange question. He says, "Why are you looking for the living among the dead?"
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: And th- that's not what they were expecting.
Seth: That wasn't.
David: They were expecting to find the dead among the dead.
Seth: And just to hammer home all these parallels, we have to, I, I'm going, backtracking.
David: Yeah.
Seth: But, like, the Pilate-Darius connection.
David: Uh-huh.
Seth: It's like the false trial happens, and so they go and get it ratified by the person who can actually do something about it.
David: Uh-huh.
Seth: Anyway, yes.
David: Yeah, and they politically twist his hand-
Seth: Yes
David: ... to say, like, and they appeal to a law. They appeal to Caesar above him.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: There's some higher political power holding and pinning you down, C- uh, Pilate, to, like, make you force your hand to do this. He's like-
Seth: Mm
David: ... "I don't really want to, but I have to. Here's my wax seal."
Seth: My gosh.
David: And he seals Jesus's death.
Seth: But just like the lions, the grave can only consume the guilty.
David: The grave can only consume the guilty. The grave... L- let's talk about this. Let's talk about the grave-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... as a test.
Seth: Yes.
David: The, the grave as a test. I've never thought about it like that before.
Seth: Yeah.
David: The, death is death.
Seth: Death is a punishment.
David: Yeah, or even-
Seth: Death is an execution. Death is-
David: Or even it's just, death is death. It just-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... you die.
Seth: Yeah.
David: And I've never thought about death in this mystical way that comes from the curse in Genesis 3-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... that death is only for the guilty.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Death is only for those who have sinned. It's the, it's its natural response. You, you, Adam and Eve sinned, death entered the world. So all who sin go into the grave. It, and it says, "Are you guilty of sin? Yes? I'll keep you."
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: But Jesus breaks the cogs of the-
Seth: Right
David: ... machinery of death-
Seth: Right
David: ... because the grave ate something that was not guilty for the first time.
Seth: Yeah.
David: And it could not hold it, because he wasn't-
Seth: Right
David: ... guilty.
Seth: Yeah, the grave is a kind of judge in this sense.
David: Yeah.
Seth: And the grave cannot find Jesus guilty.
David: Yeah.
Seth: So he has to spit him out, the same way the lions spit Daniel out.
David: Right. Death could not hold him-
Seth: Yes
David: ... because it had nothing to hold against him.
Seth: Right.
David: It was a punishment for sin, but there was no sin found in him.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: And so he is risen from the grave to prove that everything that was on the line in Darius's day, right, is now flipped on its head.
Seth: Right. Who is the true mediator between God and man?
David: Jesus.
Seth: Jesus is.
David: Right, he just proved it.
Seth: Who will ascend to his rightful throne?
David: Jesus.
Seth: Jesus will.
David: Right.
Seth: Who conquers the accusers? Who silences the accusation of the accusers?
David: Right.
Seth: Jesus.
David: Let's, let's go there because I think that is an interesting extra part of the story-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... that the enemies are defeated by their own trap. This is exactly how the New Testament talks about the powers that tried to put Jesus to death.
Seth: If they would've known-
David: They, if they would've known what would've happened, they would not have crucified the Lord.
Seth: Mm.
David: But they did, and they were defeated by it.
Seth: Right.
David: Because Satan, in trying to kill the Son of God, ended up-
Seth: Yeah
David: ... creating his, causing his own death because now, what, what does Satan have? You know, what, what, what did, what did the satraps have in his story, in Daniel's story, and what does Satan have since the beginning?
Seth: Accusations.
David: Accusations and lies. That's what his name means.
Seth: Accuser.
David: The accuser.
Seth: Ha-Satan, the accuser.
David: Right. That is what his name means. That was his job in Job, and it's, was his job in the beginning, and it's his job all the way to the end, to accuse. But what happens when the accusers in Daniel's story-
Seth: Mm
David: ... lose their accusation, when their accusations are proven irrefutably false? They fall under their own judgment.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: The ac-
Seth: They're thrown to the pit. Just-
David: They, they're thrown to the pit. They're, they're devoured by lions.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: And it's just so interesting to view Satan that way-
Seth: Mm
David: ... the one who comes to us and whispers accusations in our ears and condemnation and says, "You are guilty. You are worthless. You're going to die. There is no God. There is no resurrection for you." Lies, lies-
Seth: Mm
David: ... accusations. And it's like, man, when Jesus rose from the grave, guess who went into the tomb after him? Satan.
Seth: Mm.
David: He casts Satan down.
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: He defeats his accusations because when w- because we can now join Jesus in that resurrection. We are proven innocent when we combine ourselves with him. When we are in Christ, we too are innocent, and Satan's accusations have nothing to do but be, to be thrown to the lions.
Seth: The other thing we can say here is that it's in Jesus's name-
David: Mm
Seth: ... that the grave will not find us guilty either.
David: That's right.
Seth: We're gonna be thrown to a grave one day.
David: Yep, most likely.
Seth: Most likely, six feet under we all go.
David: Yep.
Seth: It will be our last test.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: It'll be our last trial. And if we are in Jesus, we will resurrect.
David: That's right.
Seth: We'll, that w-
David: Right
Seth: ... we will ascend to a throne with him.
David: Right. What, what are we supposed to do, knowing that the test of death and the grave lies around the corner for all of us? We do what Daniel did. We open our windows towards Jerusalem, in a sense, towards Jesus-
Seth: Mm-hmm
David: ... and we pray in his name.
Seth: Yes.
David: And when we do, the Bible comes true, and it says, "No one who trusts in Jesus will be put to shame."
Seth: Mm-hmm.
David: No one. We can say the same prayer as Daniel and just say whatever he prayed, you know? You could, [laughs] my trust is in you-
Seth: Yes
David: ... Son of Man, and we will be delivered from the trial by lions.
Seth: Do you wanna know what happens after Daniel is delivered from the trial by lions?
David: I really do.
Seth: Well then, King Darius writes to all peoples, nations, and languages that dwell on the earth.
David: Oh, boy.
Seth: Oh, boy. So again, we've talked about this a c- a couple different times in here. This phrase is repeated in almost every chapter of the Book of Daniel.
David: Mm.
Seth: It's leaning forward, where this same phrase will be used to describe the Son of Man's authority-
David: Mm
Seth: ... so the, the messianic Jesus's authority over-
David: Right
Seth: ... all kingdoms. But for now, King Darius has this authority, and he's talking to all the people under his power. "Peace be multiplied to you." And he makes a new decree, a new law, a new injunction, that, "All my royal dominion, in all my royal dominion, people are to tremble in fear before the God of Daniel. He is the living God, enduring forever. His kingdom shall never be destroyed. His dominion shall be to the end. He delivers and rescues. He works signs and wonders in heaven and on earth, he who has saved Daniel from the power of the lions." Talk about the irrevocable law of the Medes and the Persians.
David: Oh, yeah.
Seth: This is one of them now.
David: [laughs] That's good.
Seth: [laughs]
David: That's like, it's such a fun divine ironic twist.
Seth: [laughs] He humbles himself before the God of Daniel.
David: Right, yeah, and asks everyone else to as well.
Seth: Yeah.
David: Amazing.
Seth: And this is actually really important.
David: Mm.
Seth: So I t- I teased Daniel 7.
David: Yeah.
Seth: So what is this law commanding? The global worship of the one true God.
David: Right.
Seth: Because a Son of Man was lifted up out of the grave.
David: Mm.
Seth: That's, that's, the world must worship the true God because a Son of Man was lifted out of the grave.
David: Yeah.
Seth: That's what Daniel 7 is all about, and this idea that the nations, all nations, will praise God once the S- a Son of Man is raised up-
David: Mm
Seth: ... is how the Bible ends in Revelation 5 and 7.
David: Mm-hmm.
Seth: People from all tribes, languages, nations, and tongues will worship the one true God. Why? Because Jesus is on the throne.
David: And he was the lamb that was slain.
Seth: He, the lamb that was slain-
David: Right
Seth: ... is on the throne.
David: How is that possible? Because he's innocent, and he's the only mediator, and he is the king above all kings.
Seth: The grave could not consume this king.
David: That's right.
Seth: Yes.
David: And neither can it consume us when we're in him. Wow. Powerful.
Seth: Powerful stuff. Daniel, I mean, find that in your Bible, children. [laughs]
David: [laughs] Find that in your children's Bible.
Seth: That's what I meant to say. [laughs]
David: Find that in your Bible, children. They can.
Seth: They can. [laughs]
David: Oh, that's awesome. That is such a fun way to read Daniel 6 and, well, awesome. That's Daniel in the lions' den.
Seth: Daniel in the lions' den.
David: Uh, next week, as Seth has hinted at, is the infamous-
Seth: Infamous
David: ... and daunting Daniel 7.
Seth: Daniel 7.
David: Oh.
Seth: Yeah.
David: I, I mean, this is the Ancient of Days. This is the Son of Man coming on the clouds. This is the four beasts rising up.
Seth: Out of the ocean.
David: This, this i-
Seth: Yeah.
David: This is, it's a big deal.
Seth: It, the whole, so far, the whole book of Daniel has been leaning forward to that moment.
David: And then after chapter 7, the rest of Daniel will lean back on it.
Seth: Lean back on it.
David: The center.
Seth: This idea that there is one true ruler and s- a Son of Man-
David: Yep
Seth: ... someone like a son that raises up to his proper authority.
David: Yep.
Seth: That's the center of the book of Daniel.
David: Everything hinted at in the book so far is going to come into reality.
Seth: Right. The fact that Daniel keeps being seated next to Babylonian power-
David: Mm
Seth: ... is an image of God and his son-
David: Yeah
Seth: ... seating next to him in power. It, it's, the whole book's leaning here.
David: It's gonna be awesome, so don't miss. We'll see you guys in Daniel 7 next week. [upbeat music]
Outro: Thank you for listening to the Spoken Gospel podcast. Spoken Gospel creates short films, devotionals, and podcasts like this one. Everything we make is free because of generous supporters like you. To see our resources, visit spokengospel.com or subscribe to our YouTube channel. Thanks for listening. See you next week. [upbeat music]
